When the workers and friends speak of a "Revelation" they are usually referring to the fact that an "outsider" has finally caught on that the WAY is God's only true church. Would you agree with this statement?

I don't deny that some in the fellowship may have a true revelation from God. On the other hand if we continually focus on the way the workers or some other system operates, then the revelation we get will probably be related to that. From what I've seen and heard, the revelation spoken of in the fellowship is primarily to do with accepting the system of the workers and their guidelines for the church, it's not to do with God Himself. That's why it's not spoken of freely in gospel meetings. It certainly doesn't seem to give them much confidence in eternal life like a revelation from God should do.

I am wondering how many of you have had the term "revelation" used while in the 2x2's to apply to something that the members couldn't explain....likewhen my mom and I talk, she says that one must have a "revelation" to understand these things.

To me, it just sounds like a cop-out!! It means that she cannot explain what she believes, nor can she explain a reason for the silly rules and legalism that the group imposes on people!!

>>Exactly! Precisely! cop-out is right! And revelations are relative--what is a revelation to one person may just be a brainstorm or idea or theory to another!<< 1/97

>>I had no understanding of the Bible back then, except my belief that Jesus was God (although I had no Biblical backup for it at the time). When I would disagree with them on this being the only way, I would be told that Peter said, "Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life." John 6:68. I heard this verse quoted often in our meetings. At the time it was enough to keep me in subjection. I felt so ashamed that I had asked such a question.<<

Do those words "Lord, to whom shall we go? Thou hast the words of eternal life" still seem to say the same "worker thing" to you? The words I heard most to "prove their way" were: "and how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach, except they be sent?" from Romans 10, 14 + 15

>>>You said: "Yes, I CHOSE to become one of THOSE PEOPLE in THAT WAY but once I finally caught on to their belief (in themselves!) I was scared to leave. "Maybe one day God will reveal to me that this Way is the ONLY Way. Best I stick around just to be safe!

Well, towards the end of my "fellowshipping" years, this is also what went through my mind. As a matter of fact, one worker would keep on saying, "My dear, don't you see, yet? You mean you haven't had "the" revelation, yet? Just keep on going to meetings and it will be revealed to you." I was literally scared to death that I would not make it because of my lack of faith in this way.<<<

They didn't use the "Revelation" deal on me before I professed, but after I left one worker told me firmly (with her nose in the air): "Well! I guess you just never had "The Revelation!"

>>>I know this sounds blasphemous, but it got to the point that I finally said to myself, "I rather go to hell than have to be in this group." Isn't that just like satan to try us to the point of giving up?! I couldn't imagine a God that is such a respecter of persons and still be God. I couldn't imagine a God that would set such high, impossible, ridiculous ideals and then condemn me to hell for not measuring up. I couldn't imagine how the God of this universe could create me with such a longing for Him and have me in tears going to Him asking for forgiveness and to be saved, and to turn me away because I failed to go to meetings. Wed, Sun, Wed, Sun. Like one worker said to me, "If you miss meeting on Wed, and died before meeting on Sun. Well, I wouldn't want to be in your shoes. You're just gambling with your salvation. Don't you love God more than to toy with Him?"<<<

Your thought doesn't sound blasphemous to me ____. A lot of the friends come to feel that way. The "system" tends to do that to people. Unfortunately lots of the "friends" have left over the years and they still have these fears in the back of their minds. The 2x2 programming is still hanging on them, so to speak. But now with lots of information going around some of those people are learning the truth and getting mentally set free.

I'm sorry for all the fear tactics you had to endure, _____. It seems to me the workers were more direct with their words to you than they were to me. They were much more subtle with me.

>>>You said: "After all these are wonderful people. Hospitable! Friendly! Can't do enough for me, etc. etc." I disagree again with the last part. Since I asked too many questions from the beginning and was in trouble with them because of it to the point that baptism was denied me, they didn't do anything for me. It's like they spread the word out there about me. I had children while attending meetings, I had an operation, we had serious family health problems, and never did a worker or a "friend" come to offer assistance. Other churches wouldn't hear of such lack of love. They're there with baby sitting, food, cleaning, help in any shape or form. This is also something I mentioned to the workers. I questioned the love they always said marked a true church. They always responded without exception, "The "Way" is perfect, but the people are not. There are some that don't measure up, but they will get their just reward." Again I would state that "no one" had shown any care. Their responses were, "You're just having too much stress. If your husband was professing, you'd see it better. But because you have a "divided" home, you just can't partake of the blessings." Whatever that means!<<<

I need to clarify here, and say that this "wonderful people" phenomenon was mostly my experience at the beginning of my "walk" in the "Way." I really DID find them that way in the beginning at least, ____.

But since I've left the group I've learned that the friends are not the same in all places. I suppose there are many reasons for this. As the years went by and I was "in my place" for longer and longer I began to see some things that I didn't think were right. Sometimes just little things. And, like you, those words: "The "Way" is perfect, but the people are not" used to ring in my ears and keep me "in" for many more years than if they had not had that little "gem" to say. I used to say it myself!

I'm so sorry for the experiences you had _____. I can sense you went through so much mental agony. At least it helped get you out sooner, if that's any consolation!

>>>Well, ____, you can see you're not the only one that had a nerve struck. I'm not bitter, even though this might sound that way. I was hurt and confused while this was going on. After I left, I was hurt and angry. But that didn't last but a month at the most. I have peace now -- true peace. At times I feel like I wasted the best years of my life in there, but not so. I now have discernment which I exercise frequently. I search the Scriptures carefully to see if what I'm hearing is so. I know I belong to His family, which embodies all believers not just the "fellowship" ones.<<<

My bitterness still surfaces from time to time but I've finally reached the point that (along with thanking God for helping me get out of the "Way") I thank Him for getting me *into* the "Way." Why? Because being in the fellowship was the beginning of my spiritual walk with God. While it was mostly agony for all those years I was able to find HIM in the long run. I believe God uses many ways to reveal Himself to us. If it takes the 2x2 experience to do it then I guess that is the way it must be! My relationship with God is PURE JOY now!

I heard getting or not getting a "revelation" many times while "in". I used the term myself many times talking about others. I was one of the ones that "had" the revelation which was believing that the 2x2 way was the ONE & ONLY way to Heaven. But this revelation thing was very hard to explain any further except that God had to give the revelation or reveal it to people. While "in" I believed in a works salvation, so the rules didn't seem silly at the time, but I followed them blindly as I thought they were necessary and that I was suffering for Christ. It sure does sound like a "cop-out" now as I couldn't explain why I believed that way except for having a "revelation"! I think I just made a complete circle.....

How wonderful it is now to be FREE from BONDAGE! Praise God! 12/96

Thought I'd add my bit about the REVELATION factor. We are constantly hearing this from _____’s parents and it IS a bit of a thorn in our flesh. Dictionary definition: revealing, making known something that was secret or hidden. Something revealed, especially something surprising. So we take that definition, then ask his parents, so what is the revelation--show us. They then say, "we can't explain it!" They know this but they can't explain it?? So what IS your revelation? "Well, you don't have it,so YOU don't understand it!" In other words it's still hidden. . . some revelation isn't it? 12/96

Revelation in the fellowship (my way of saying 2x2 church or "truth") is the coming to an understanding and agreement with the workers without being told something directly.

Examples:

"We want to be in the ark" [workers mean…] "We want to be in this way".

"Jesus sent out the twelve in this manner" [workers mean…] "Only those who go out in this manner are Jesus' messengers".

"We need to die to self" [workers mean…] "You have to accept what I am telling you" . . . . And a host more.

TRUE revelation is:

"We want to be in the ark" . . "We want to be in Christ".

"Jesus sent out the twelve in this manner". . . "There was a certain situation and a certain commission for a short time..."

"We need to die to self" . . . "We need to die to our own will so that Christ can live in us."

Sure, the workers and friends would tell us that this is what the workers mean. However, we all know what the next step is from their agreeing with true revelation.