*** SALVATION ***

I can't say I KNEW I wasn't saved but I thought it was unlikely because I didn't think I obeyed or believed enough of what the workers taught. I had a desire to "be like Christ" and I worked hard to make this a fact in my life but there was always a feeling within that I fell short of the mark and since God seemed like a distant relative to me rather than a Father I couldn't very well ask Him about it, could I?

About a year before I left I came across a Christian radio station with a woman giving her heartfelt testimony about when she came to Christ. Even though I knew I shouldn't be listening to "false teaching" I was drawn by the passion in her voice. She had made many wrong choices in her life and experienced the consequences of a life of sin. I was riveted to my car radio by the description of the transformation that took place in her heart when she accepted God's precious gift of salvation. One of her statements about had me driving off the road because I had never heard anything like it before. She said how thankful she was that all her sins, past, present and future were nailed to the cross with Christ forever!

She mentioned Col.1:13-15 (NIV Bible): "When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; He took it away nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross."

I had never heard anything like this and when I got home I looked up those verses and the tears rained down my face. I knew that Paul was partly referring to the Jewish law but to me "the written code, with its regulations that was against us and opposed us" was the teaching that I had heard from childhood. The teaching that said if I didn't attend meetings and fellowship with people who professed through the workers I wasn't saved. The teaching that the outward appearance of a woman is the evidence of her salvation. The teaching that implied if I didn't follow what the workers said the door of heaven might be shut in my face. Oh dear God, were the words of this woman true? Were these words of scripture true? Were my sins really nailed to the cross forever?

I pondered this for a while and asked my husband if he thought it was true that our sins weren't something we needed to carry around with us like a big laundry sack of filthy clothes. He didn't know either and we eventually sought help from a friend who teaches at a local seminary (Bible School). He was a handy guy to know, let me tell you! When Fred explained the pure, unembellished gospel story to us we sat there on his couch holding hands and crying like babies. He showed us many verses, including Jesus'own words, that assured us of our eternal security, that as believers we would dwell with Him forever. My favorite was, and I think will always be, Romans 10:9,10. "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

And how could JESUS have the power to do all this for me? Because He is God, of course; God the Son. (I had never heard this either.) When I finally understood how much God loves me, enough to become as a vulnerable child, a blood sacrifice for my sin, my heart was broken. Jesus was not my elder brother who died on the cross so I might have a chance to work my way to heaven! He was not just pointing to His successors who would go out two and two and would tell us how to live so we might have the privilege of joining Him one day! He is my Savior, the perfect One and no one and nothing can stand between us! I have to tell you I weep as I write this but I weep for joy. The joy of finally having the intimate relationship with the Father God, my Abba, that I craved all my life and found at the age of Thirty-Six.

One of my favorite worship song says, "All I once held dear, built my life upon, all this world reveres and wars to own. All I once thought gain I have counted loss, spent and worthless now compared to this. Knowing You Jesus, knowing You, there is no greater thing. You're may all, You're the best, You're my joy my righteousness, and I love You Lord."

(Name withheld by request of the writer to protect her professing family.) Sept 2000

P.S. I am not a worker basher. I believe that most of them are as deceived as everyone else in The Way and my heart goes out to them just as it does all those who believe their salvation comes from a system of worship. And Yes, I know there are some Friends who know their salvation is in Christ but sadly, there are few of them.

I am so very thankful I know, at long last, the true meaning of grace; "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God" Ephesians 2:8. That salvation is a free gift we cannot do anything to earn or merit, Romans 5:15-18. "…the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" Romans 6:23. We cannot work our way to heaven. I know that I am not worthy of this free gift, but I am so very thankful for it. I want to do everything I possibly can to please Him for His "unspeakable gift." Jesus paid for the sins of all men when He shed His blood and died upon the cross. Jesus said, "I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do" John 17:4; "It is finished…" John 19:30. We cannot do anything to add to the work Jesus finished. Jesus’ resurrection was proof God accepted the price He paid for our Redemption. He opened heaven’s doors. Without Jesus’ finished work there would have been no route to heaven for mankind. That’s why He said He was the way and that nobody could come to the Father, unless they went through Him. I now know the way is the Savior—Jesus Christ.

I see nothing wrong with meeting in a home, not watching television, not wearing jewelry, or any other personal choice, but when these things are elevated as evidence of salvation, we are taking our eyes off of God, and are focusing instead on outward appearance (ourselves). For apart from Him, there is nothing we can do for our own salvation.

Before I left the 2x2s, I remember having a discussion with a colleague of mine at work. The discussion found its way to the subject of a person losing their salvation which so often leads into a discussion of works verses faith. She made a comment I never forgot and to this day I thank her for it when I see her. I was going on and on about how God responds to the things we do for Him and it is in the doing of these things that pleases Him and causes Him to draw close to us. And the reverse is true that when we do bad things He pulls away until we repent and get things right again. Then my friend offered this simple insight. She said that it was difficult for her to see it that way because with my way aperson would be motivated to do good by fear and with her way a person is motivated to good works by their love relationship with their God. That thought stuck with me and now that I know this Christian walk has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with relationship my world has been a very different place to live. 1/97

____, your mention of the term "saved" brought back these memories.

I asked Howard Mooney, head worker, what he meant by the word "saved." It was finally seeping through to me that they meant something quite different from the meaning I gave the word.

He said, "well, Joan, it would be a good idea to do a study on that word. Look at the different ways it is used in the Bible." I did a study, and I still didn't know the answer to my question. Howard was good at evading, or answering your question in such a way (in his kind voice) that you THOUGHT you had the question answered, or in this case you would find the answer, and a little while later realized he hadn't answered you at all.

Sometime the year of our exit John Sterling, worker, told me in answer to this same question that that was an "ambiguous term" and that "no one knows they are saved until after they die." After 13 years, I finally understood what being saved meant to them! It certainly didn't mean the same as Paul stated in 1 Cor 1:18, "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which ARE SAVED it is the power of God." 1/97 Joan Daniel

God has really cleared my mind to be sure of what I believe - that we are only saved through the blood of Jesus with nothing added in the way of good works or self effort or being baptised into a particular church. I 'm free from that sort of bondage - and there's no way I want to go back there!!!! 1/97 Linda Taw, New Zealand

As for me, peoples, my current church is very adamant in the fact that we, our church, our denomination are NOT the only ones. Anyone who accepts the essentials of faith - Salvation through the work of Christ on the cross, a free gift of grace - should be accepted as a Christian brother, regardless of how or where they came to this understanding, or where they worship. I disagree with Richard that any church that teaches the "Whole Truth" of the Bible is the "only" church. Many churches teach incorrect doctrines at different times, but true believers can still exist in these churches. And I would have to say that some true believers exist in the 2x2s, even though the teaching of the group as a whole is heretical. There are also many churches who do have the right essentials and teachings, yet have unsaved people in them! 1/97

I do not belong to a "denomination," but the fellowship that I attend does NOT believe they are the one true church as the 2x2s do. Instead, I believe you do not need to "join a church," but be born again into the forever family of God. Therefore, you may be a Baptist, Presbyterian, etc. and if you believe and receive the Lord Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior then we both belong to the one true church, the Bride of Christ. 1/97

I don't believe appearance has anything to do with salvation or being a Christian . 1/97

Regarding Jesus and salvation, I had a discussion with my dad just the other day. He is currently in the 2x2s. I basically asked him what was his hope of salvation. He said that he had to believe in Jesus, and to follow in His footsteps.

I told him that I agree with the first part of his answer. A person DOES have to believe in Jesus. My father says that it is not enough to just believe, but that you have to do "stuff" after you believe, to be saved.

I believe that this is a total perversion of the grace of God.

I do not think that my dad came to his conclusion based on just reading the Bible, but on a lifetime of going to meeting.

The Bible states often that one must believe in the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved. I tried to explain to my dad that BELIEF is enough, but he did not agree. He says that you must be involved in the 2x2s; go to meetings in homes being led by homeless ministers who take no salary to be sure of your salvation. He considers that doing those things or that "stuff" equals: dying to self. According to my dad, if you are involved in any other group which does things differently, even if you believe in Jesus, then you are on a one way path to HELL.

Since leaving the fellowship I firmly believe God's grace has to be received. You cannot reject Christ’s sacrifice on the cross and say that you are going to do a "bunch of stuff" to earn your way to heaven.

Relying on the "Truth" (a system) does NOT sound like good news to me. GOOD NEWS is that I can be saved by believing in the Lord Jesus Christ. That he will take my sin upon Himself and be my Advocate before the Father. GOOD NEWS is NOT a belief in Jesus *and* maintain continued membership in the 2x2s by submitting to worker authority and worker interpretation of the Bible.

And so, YES! Belief *is* enough! And yes, I realize that belief will precede action. You will be able to tell who believes by the type of life they live, but it is a relationship based upon LOVE rather than law. 1/97

What a joy to now be living in FORGIVENESS rather than to be living in GUILT! 2/97

There is real peace in knowing that the price for our sin is paid in FULL. There is a real joy in knowing that I don’t have to add a few things to that for God to be pleased. It is so nice to realize that he did it once and for all time, you don't have to beg forgiveness each day, it is already done, just praise HIM for that, that is all that he wants. When he said it is finished, he meant all the rules and laws, the constant offering the bulls and goats was over, once and for all the sacrifice was made and the price was paid!! Never never to be necessary again! 2/97

Salvation doesn't have to be renewed on a daily basis. Salvation is given once--eternal life isn't given one day, snatched away the next, withheld because we had a bad thought or did a bad deed one minute, then given back when we think a good thought or do a good thing. This is the 2x2 logic that it is "works-based salvation" i.e. be good enough & you can earn your own salvation. At that rate, Christ didn't have to die on the cross for us because we could do enough good things to earn it for ourselves. It is a free, unmerited gift--we are saved by grace through faith. 2/97

I appreciated your quote of: "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure"

Many people trust in other people for their salvation, rather than trusting in God. We can rely on a just God, Who draws us to Himself, provides us with a robe of righteousness, and paid the penalty for our sins.

I'm glad my salvation is not left up to my efforts. It would put much fear and trembling in me to work out my own salvation. I'm glad it is God Who is working in me. Another great verse: Phil 1:6 "Being confident of this very thing, that He which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ." 2/97

How sad if even ONE person would go to a lost eternity because they believed the fold (i.e., The Way) was their "ticket" to heaven. The sheepfold is NEVER what gives a sheep security. The sheep would be no safer IN the fold, without the Shepherd standing guard, than he would be out in the wilderness. WITH the Shepherd watching over him, he is just as safe in the wilderness as he is in the sheepfold. We must be putting our trust and reliance on the LORD, not on our connection to a system.

As long as there is a chance that some are confused on this issue, my heart cries out to the Lord... that they would know the REAL truth and that truth could set them free!! 4/97

I believe that most, if not all, the workers that I came in contact with encouraged this uncertainty of salvation. I was in a convention once where a worker spoke that the way was so narrow that maybe only one person out of every-one there would make it to heaven (and there were quitea few workers)!! Now I look back on it as a very effective tool for keeping everyone in line - I know it scared me to death. It truly was "the power to trap and the power to keep".

I cannot look back on the 20 years I spent professing and say it was peaceful. Pretty much hellfire and damnation!!! Sad....... I am truly grateful that finally I have peace and joy - mostly because I stopped looking outside myself for the answers on how to find it!! 4/97

I had written: "... but, can these people who NEVER think they can know for sure, REALLY suddenly know for sure that their loved one is in heaven? Do they really have the comfort of the assurance one would THINK they had listening to the message? Or are they still left wondering...just as they must wonder and hope about their own salvation?"

____ responded: "The friends really do not doubt their salvation. They know as long as they profess that they will be saved. What they doubt is being able to stay in the fellowship.

No, siree-bob!! I STRONGLY disagree here!! When I was professing (though others may have doubted it at times) I was a STICKER!! If someone had told me even SIX MONTHS before I left that I would be out within a year, I would have told them they were CRAZY!! When my brother quit going to the meetings (about a year before I did) I wrote him a LONG letter (You all can understand what I mean when I say *I* wrote a LONG letter!!?!) encouraging him to keep on keeping on. When my Mom quit going to meetings (about 8 months before I did) I had several "talks" with her (and with my Dad). I was VERY concerned. Yes, we knew there were things that were not right, but we just HAD to keep on... after all, this was the Truth... it was God's Way!

A little less than six months before I left, we went to Milltown Convention. My sis had just recently got "David Stone's" book. Between meetings, she went to her tent trailer to read. We'd stop by and she'd read portions to us. At one point she made the comment that she thought she was just going to quit going to meetings and start going to the church her neighbors went to. I was HORRIFIED!! Even if she was merely JOKING, I didn't want to hear her talking that way!! We could TALK about the things that were wrong, but we MUSTNOT walk away from the Way!!

So, no matter what OTHERS may have thought as they saw me trim up my hair and get perms, miss meetings in an effort to have more time with _____ and the kids, etc... I was absolutely sincere in my professing and I ALWAYS KNEW I was IN TO STAY!! Yet, I wasn't a bit certain about my salvation. I can remember many a time being troubled about it. After all, _____, our salvation depended on our works... No one but God knew better than I did how far short I came from what and who I wanted to be. Many times, I can remember praying about it. Even the Bible told us that the heart was deceitful and desperately wicked. What if I only THOUGHT I had surrendered my life to God, yet, I was really selfishly refusing to "die to self"? Was my profession real in GOD'S eyes? Did God see my sincerity of heart? If I were to die right now, would He bring me to heaven? I honestly never knew.

Though it's true that I thought I needed to have the connection to "God's Way" in order to be saved, I NEVER supposed THAT, in and of itself, was enough. After all, if the branches (connected to the vine) failed to produce fruit, they could be cut off and thrown into the fire. My salvation depended on my continuing performance. I knew as hard as I tried, I could NEVER be perfect (oh, soooo far from it!!!) and I didn't have any idea how much was required of me in order to gain God's smile of approval and His eternal reward. 4/97

Is it any wonder we have come away from the 2x2 system without really knowing sweet-tweet about the Bible and God's plan of salvation? We only learned that men had a cool way of gathering 'em together--but we couldn't even back that up with scripture!

I believe that life for me started about 5 years ago when I received a revelation of who Jesus is, because that is the moment I truly believed in Him as my God & Saviour and therefore accepted Him into my life. And I think that is when my relationship with Him started.

>>That is the same for me. I was reading a book on cults and the book indicated that cults deny the deity of Jesus Christ. I had NO IDEA what that meant but there was a reference to JN 1:1 and 1:14. I read those two verses together and I immediately KNEW in whom I believed! Those verses lead me to KNOW in my heart that Jesus is God come in the flesh. That awesome heart knowledge gave me a bond to Jesus I had never known before. That was the beginning of my walk with God and my acceptance, through faith, in what Christ did for me on the Cross.<<6/97

You know it's funny you mention "Little House on the Prairie". After my G-ma moved in with us, she brought a TV with her, I was allowed to watch certain shows with her and LHOTP was one of them. I remember asking my mom if the families on that show in particular went to heaven. I pointed out that they wore long dresses, had long hair up in buns, went to church every Sunday as well as didn't work at all on Sundays, had good family morals, etc.... all good exterior shows of professing families. Her answer to me was that there was no way they had made it to heaven because even though they had the look and most of the characteristics of professing people the fact that they went to the church in town rather than search out the truth-which she assured me was in existence at that time!-that in it's self did not allow them to go to heaven when they died! I watched and watched and never could imagine that Pa, Ma, Mary, Laura and Carrie went to hell when they had died. I even read and reread the books and never could believe that God would have turned His back on these people who had struggled and worshipped in good times and bad just because they didn't search out a religion that didn't even exist until the story was almost at it's end. Those people in the books and portrayed on the TV show where some of the most Christian people ever written about and I am glad to know that they will be waiting for us all when we make it to heaven, too! 7/97

>>Just had to write and say Thanks for your e-mail about LHOTP! It really struck a chord with me. I also used to wonder about the seemingly Christian people I read about in various books etc. It used to really disturb me that these people were lost just because they didn't have the "workers".<<