ACCOUNT OF THE VIETNAM DIVISION
Chapter 1 – The GOLDEN TIME - 1956-1975
Chapter 2 - Canadian Overseers Arrive – Late 1990’s
Chapter 3 - Continuing in The Way as Before – 2010-2013
Epilogue - October, 2014
The following Account of the Vietnam Division was compiled by Cherie Kropp from statements made during the years 2013 and 2014 by Nguyễn Huu Bau, his daughter Nguyễn Thị Minh Thanh and her husband Nguyễn Xuân Hoàn, who all reside in Saigon/HCMC and Nguyễn Thanh Hoa, a Brother Worker, who is no relation to the others.
My name is Nguyễn HuuBau, and I am 84 years old, and my wife is 81. We met the Workers in 1956 through Uncle Châu’s family at the Protestant Church. Both of us professed the same night in 1961. We’re the first couple in the way in Vietnam. Our home also is the first place for Fellowship Meeting in Vietnam times. We had 7 children, 11 grandchildren and 6 great grandchildren. Four of my children opened their houses for Fellowship Meeting and bread and cup. All 7 children professed and three have passed away. View Early Family Photo.
My name is Nguyễn Thị Minh Thanh (aka Minh Thanh or MT) . I'm the third child of Mr. & Mrs. Bau, the second generation in this Way. I professed when I was twelve years old. My family used to welcome the Workers coming to have meals at my home or stay. We used to have Sunday morning and midweek meetings at our house for thirty years. We had wonderful fellowship with Workers and Friends. MT was six years old when her parents professed in 1961, and she is now 60 years old. She and XuânHoàn met at Convention, married in February, 1979 and lived in Dalat for more than 20 years before moving to Saigon. They have two grown professing children, a daughter and a son, and 3 grandsons. Unless noted otherwise, most of the quotes below in italics are by Minh Thanh.
My name Xuân Hoàn. I'm Minh Thanh's husband. All my family and relatives are Catholic. I am the only one in the Way. I am happy to have my wife and two children accompanying me in this way. I was born and raised in Catholic. I was very zealous with my belief. Since my childhood, I studied and lived in a school belonging to Catholic with many priests as teachers. My mother and seven brothers and sisters went to church every day. In 1973 I was studying at the University of Dalat. As I was leaving, two ladies were by the gate distributing invitations to Gospel Meetings and to a Bible class in English. I went to the Bible class to learn English. The teachers were Bonnie Dahlin and Phyllis Munn, and both spoke Vietnamese fluently. The students each read one phrase in the Book Luke and then she explained the meaning. For the first time, I began to understand the Bible. I went to their Gospel Meetings and I professed. Only a few months later the Liberation Day came, and all the foreign Workers had to leave the country. I was the only believer in Dalat which is 300 km from Saigon. Before Auntie Bonnie left, she wrote me a letter saying, "Don't be afraid of death but be afraid that whether we will still keep our faith to the end." (View Story in Appendix)
Nguyễn Thanh Hoa attended the Gospel Meetings of Phyllis Munn and Bonnie Dahlin held in Saigon. He was from Saigon, South Vietnam and was 21 years old. He was drawn to follow the Way the workers preached because of the spirit found in Uncle Fred’s meetings. He wrote: My younger brother brought me to Phyllis Munn and Bonnie Dahlin's batch in order to study English. They used the English Gospel text to teach in their classes. Before I met with the Gospel, my family was just like the great crowd of Vietnamese, who practise the worship of our ancestors and grandparents. In fact I never called myself a Buddhist. My widowed mother felt sad at first as my brother and I professed; but she professed 1 year before her death at the age of 86. Besides, one of my elder sisters and a niece [belongs to the other sister] professed. Phyllis and Bonnie brought me to Fred Allen, who had many English classes and Gospel Meetings.
Nguyễn Thanh Hoa was the first person to profess in VN and the first native worker to enter the work, in April, 1967. After 43 years in the work, he stopped cooperating with the Canadian Overseers and has continued his ministry independent of them. He is currently a Worker among the Golden Friends, still holding Missions and spreading the Word of God to outsiders.
Statements in italics by the family members listed above were made in personal emails to Cherie Kropp and Edgar Massey and in posts made on the Truth Meetings Forum thread titled Vietnam started by Edgar Massey on May 23, 2013.
Note about Vietnam Name sequence: Their surname or last name is given first, then their middle name, and their first name is given last. For Example, Mr. Bau’s full name is written: Nguyễn Huu Bau . In English, it would be written as: Bau Huu Nguyễn. It is respectful to refer to older people as “Mr. Bau” or “Uncle Bau.” Married women retain their maiden names and do not take the name of their husband. Please understand that some people in this Account who are called “Uncle” or “Aunt” may not be blood relatives!
Liberation Day was April 30, 1975, the End of the Vietnam War, also known as Reunification Day.
Certain terminology has been capitalized to emphasize that these words should be understood in the 2x2 context. Permission was given to Cherie Kropp to edit original quotes for English, grammar and spelling. Original quotations were retained as much as possible.
Mission Statement of the Nguyễn Family for this Account
We only want the Workers and Friends to know the truth about what has happened in Vietnam, especially the Vietnamese Friends around the world. We have written this Account so others can examine the situation and understand things as they really are. Things that even the Vietnamese Friends and Workers never knew about--evil things that were hidden and covered up with a beautiful outer surface! It is our sincere hope that the Overseers and Workers do not repeat this behavior again in another place as they have done in the past at Alberta, Canada and more recently in Vietnam.
We thank God for opening a way for us through the internet so we could understand and be comforted by our Friends in many other places throughout the world who have had similar experiences. Our only purpose is to tell the truth so no one can continue to destroy the peace of God any more!
We value the Fellowship with each other and with God very much. We were very satisfied in God’s Way until the Canadian Workers (Dale Shultz, Lyle Shultz and Darrel Turner) came to VN and caused trouble and changed many things. We only desire to have the Fellowship, love and unity that we had for many years previously before all the unnecessary changes were made. Throughout our lives, nearly 50 years of following God, we have felt that our lives have been far richer than we could ever have imagined. We wanted and prayed that a miracle would be done to correct everything back to the right. But finally, we gave up. Sad to say, the Golden Time wasn’t allowed to continue as it should have! What has happened in Vietnam has pained us deeply and made us very sad.
We all talked to and wrote many letters to ask the Canadian Workers to make things right as Jesus had taught. It seemed that the Canadian Overseers just didn’t care about solving the many issues. We waited for a long time believing a solution would open up…but it was hopeless! We learned that the solution is to keep the truth and go on. Surely, we want to obey what the Lord teaches us in the Bible, even if that means we disagree with the Overseers’ leading. Dale Shultz even warned the Friends in a letter: “… this effort requires your full cooperation. We appeal to all of you to work closely and cooperatively with Lyle and Lloyd. This is the order that our great teacher honors and blesses and is the only hope of unity and joy being restored in fullest measure.
We miss the sweet Fellowship that we had a long time ago in the Golden Time, but we have not written this Account because we want to have Fellowship with them again (although there are many good Friends still there.) Right now we are leaning on what the Spirit spoke to the Church at Thyratira in Revelation 2:25 “Only hold fast to what you have until I come.”
Our family did not leave the 2x2 Fellowship in VN because we read the TTT website or any other similar websites. We left because we saw that the new Overseers in our country were leading the folks without the Spirit of God. We did not see the love and unity among the Workers, and did not find the truth in their words. Many other bad works we have seen and heard about how they have treated the Friends and Workers who didn't obey or bow down to their rule. We also didn’t agree with the Overseers saying the Workers should be given the highest place of respect. (While our Lord Jesus gave us a big example in the Bible in cleaning his disciples’ feet. How humble HE IS). That’s the reason our family decided to leave Meetings.
We are holding much information, material, letters and even recordings concerning the troubling things that took place throughout the past three years, 2010 thru 2013 which we are sharing with you here. (see Appendix)
CHAPTER 1 – The Golden Time - 1956 to 1999
In 1957, the first Workers arrived in Vietnam. They were Fred Allen from Queensland, Australia and Maurice Archer from New Zealand. In early 1960, t he first Sister Workers arrived. They were Bonnie Dahlin and Phyllis Munn from Western USA. The natives were impressed that the Sisters spoke Vietnamese so beautifully and fluently. The Sisters stayed in Vietnam from 1960-65 when it wasn’t considered safe for them to be there; and returned again in 1971-75.
In 1958, Fred and Maurice began holding Gospel Meetings in their bach at 123 Ba Huyen Thanh Quan Street, District 3, Saigon. This Mission lasted for several years. Maurice only stayed a short time and then Fred’s brother Edwin Allen arrived. The Workers had no jobs and didn’t attend a school.
In Saigon in June, 1961 in the Gospel Meetings of Phyllis Munn and Bonnie Dahlin, Nguyễn Thanh Hoa and Vu Ngoc Châu were the first natives to profess. Both men were 21 years old and were from Saigon. Uncle Châu was a Protestant English teacher from North Vietnam. Uncle Hoa was from South Vietnam and worked in an imprint factory . Uncle Hoa wrote: Châu and I both professed the same night in a sense, but later on he told us that he did not raise his hand when Phyllis tested the meeting, so they kept him back after all went home, and they talked him to profess after a few hours later.
Mr. Bau's brother, an ex-pastor, introduced Mr. and Mrs. Nguyễn Huu Bau to Fred Allen and they came to the Gospel Meetings. At the time, they were 32 and 28 years old and had five children. Two more children were born later. His profession was photography, and he worked most of his years for the VN government and retired in 1989.
Mr. Bau wrote: By chance I met the Way of God, and both of us professed on the same night in 1961. After 6 months, my whole family came to the Gospel Meetings, not only to hear but also to ask many questions that many other religions couldn’t answer! The principal thing that touched us to profess was the image of God that we could see through the living lives of the Workers. Seeing the very simple and friendly Workers, my wife said, ‘I saw Jesus in their life.’
Both of us used to belong to the Protestant way. I was disappointed in the Protestant way which I had grown up in since a little boy. I respected and feared the Lord with all my heart, because I felt that was the way of God. I learned by heart many chapters in the Bible. I worked with all my best in the service. I became the famous Chief of the young people. Owing to many good results I got a big reward from the Chairman, but the more I worked, the more I saw there are many things that were not suitable with the Bible. So I issued a magazine to ask the leaders to correct things to the right way as Jesus taught. They refused and forbade! This is the main reason I got away from them! Today, I am faced with the same thing!!
In June, 1961, the first Sunday Fellowship Meeting was held at “the Brothers’ bach at 378D Đien Bien Phu Str, District 3, Saigon (from June to November because there were a few Friends with four Workers). We were the first married couple in The Way in Vietnam. In December, 1961, our home also was the first place for the Fellowship Meeting with bread and cup. There were present “only Châu, Hoa, two of us, and two or three more, but they stopped soon!”Eventually,four of my children also opened their houses for Fellowship Meetings with bread and cup.
After Mr. Nguyễn Huu Bau and his wife professed, the Workers did not ask them to make any changes in their appearance because we know very well so long time how to live please the Lord. So now, we just put it into practice. They gave us no rules, only preaching. The wearing long hair in buns is a custom for Vietnamese females. People consider it is charming. In God’s Way, Workers continue to encourage female Friends to wear long hair with buns. The Sister Friends and Workers wear skirts and drive motorbikes wearing skirts.
Mr. Bau wrote: Because I myself understood that it’s the Way of God, Fred didn’t tell us anything about 2x2 history and about when the way started. They preached and lived in The Way that was nearer with the Bible than other ways I had met. Through the past 50 years, he had the great privilege to meet thousands of Friends and hundreds of Workers in 9 countries such as London, Paris, Australia and USA...and to send email letters to 50 ones within 18 places throughout the world. Especially we had a very good opportunity to welcome many Workers and Friends from abroad, particularly the American soldiers by the time the war in Vietnam. We did enjoy so much in God’s Way. How wonderful it is! We were satisfied by the deed of both sides, spiritual and material. We were so happy to tell to some of our friends and relatives about knowing the Way of God.
First Baptism: In early 1962 at a swimming pool in Saigon, the first baptism was held. Approximately 10 people had professed by this time and were baptized, including Mr. and Mrs. Nguyễn Huu Bau, who were re-baptised, having been baptized previously in a Protestant church.
First Conventions: The first Conventions were held at the Brother Workers’ bach in Saigon from 1962 to 1982, and at the Youth Hostel at Dalat from 1963-1966. After 1982 there were no Conventions held in Vietnam because the government didn’t allow us to hold a big gathering such as a Convention.
First Native Workers: The two first Vietnamese natives to offer their lives for the work were Nguyễn Thanh Hoa in April, 1967 and Vu Ngoc Châu in August that same year. This was six years after they both professed.
Uncle Hoa wrote: Before I met with the Gospel, my family was just like the great crowd of Vietnamese who practise the worship of our ancestors and grandparents. I never called myself a Buddhist. My younger brother brought me to Phyllis Munn and Bonnie Dahlin's batch in order to study English [they used the English Gospel text to teach in their classes]. Then they brought me to Fred Allen, who had many English classes and Gospel Meetings. The deepest impression from Fred's meetings was ‘letter kills, but the Sprit makes alive.’
When my brother and I professed, my widowed mother felt sad at first, but she professed one year before her death at the age of 86. One of my elder sisters and a niece also professed. My younger brother did not raise his hand but he went to the Wednesday meetings with all who professed and kept coming with the group. A few years after 1975, Bonnie Dahlin told him to stop coming to meeting, so he has kept away since. He is now in the USA. My professing mother and sister died many years ago. Now my niece professes but gets upset with Darrel T and spends her time to study in a nursing school over in America. She keeps the faith in her heart but doesn't come to mtg. I don't blame her. Now I have no professing relatives alive in Vietnam. Nevertheless some of my unprofessing relatives keep giving me hope, as they are happy whenever I stop over at their homes to see them.
Uncle Châu read in a magazine about the history of the formation of the Protestant church during the Year of Jubilee (1975). When he realized it was founded by man, he decided it was wrong and so he left the Protestant church and began to follow the Workers Way.
Uncle Châu’s parents had 10 children and they all belong to the Protestant church. Only Uncle Châu is the only one who professed and he is the only one still living in Vietnam. Some of his siblings left VN after Liberation Day (April 30, 1975), and some left some years later.
V ũ Trung Hiền, Uncle Châu’s youngest brother wrote: “A few years before she went to be with the Lord, in 1992, my mother wrote to Brother Châu: "My dear son, I have 10 children, and I have given you, my precious pearl, to God, as my tithe. I have no regret in offering you to him although sometimes, I can't help wondering who will take care of you, especially when I am half the globe away from you, and you are living under difficult situation over there..."
Minh Thanh wrote: All foreign Workers had to leave VN in 1975. Châu and Hoa continued to keep the folks very well, safe and increasing in all ways! Uncle Châu is a friendly, easy to get close to man and everybody esteemed Uncle Hoa, who was a quiet man filled with the Spirit of God in his words and deeds.For 50 years, everything kept running well on the foundation that we do enjoy. In 1990, our country opened the door to foreigners, so the foreign Workers came here again and most were Canadians.
Giving the Church a Name: In 1967, Fred Allen registered the church with the Vietnamese Government as the Christian Mission in Vietnam ("Sứ Mạng các Thánh Đồ") and gave his name as the responsible leader. The four Friends on the managing committee are: Miss Lan, Đào Hữu Phỉ (passed away), Nguyễn Huu Bau, and Nguyễn Thanh Hoa. The Vietnamese Friends “don't mind what the name is. We just want the leaders should follow what is taught in the Bible and have the image of Jesus Christ in their life.
Right after Liberation Day, Uncle Hoa made a declaration to the Government that Uncle Hoa and Châu were continuing the Christian Mission in Vietnam. Uncle Châu and Uncle Hoa were and still are the registered leaders with the VN government. The Church is registered one time with the VN government. The house owners register their church affiliation one time. When there is a new place of gathering (a Meeting), the house owner has to register it with the local authorities. Foreigners are not allowed to preach to native Vietnamese--only to foreigners.
First Native Sister Worker: In 1970, Ho Thư Anh from Saigon professed. In 1972, when she was 22 years old, she was the first native Sister Worker to enter the work, and Phyllis Munn was her companion. She left the work ten years later in 1982. Băng Ngoc was another native sister worker in the early times. One time she visited friends in a very strict area and was captured and put into prison. After many months they let her go free. After prison she stopped the work because of fear. She later married and moved to Canada. The two native brother workers still kept on through many hard conditions. Uncle Hoa contracted tuberculosis and recovered .
The Overseers of Vietnam from 1957 have been: Alex Mitchell (from New Zealand?), Fred Allen (from Australia), Vu Ngoc Châu and Nguyễn Thanh Hoa (from Saigon, Vietnam), Cliff Toane (from BC, Canada/Hong Kong), Jim Chafee (from South Dakota, USA/Hong Kong/China.)
Hong Kong evolved into a staff that covered all of China, including Vietnam. It was when Overseer Jim Chafee left that VN became a separate jurisdiction from China and the Canadians took over--which was the beginning of the present distress. Starting in 2009, Darrel Turner (from Alberta, Canada) became Overseer; and in February, 2010, Lyle Shultz arrived (from Saskatchewan, Canada/India) and took the role of VN Overseer.
When Fred Allen went to Vietnam, Alex Mitchell was the Overseer over Singapore, Malaysia, Borneo, Thailand and Vietnam until 1974 when his memory failed and he returned to New Zealand, where he died in 1980 at the age of 84. In 2014, his brother Edwin Allen is still living in Queensland, Australia. Edwin also preached in Vietnam.
Recently when he learned that Alex Mitchell had been the VN Overseer when he professed, Mr. Bau wrote: Truly to say, I didn’t know Fred and Edwin had an Overseer! The VN natives viewed Fred Allen as the Missionary who brought the Way of God to them. Until “the Canadian Workers came, we never knew there is a position in God’s Way of "Overseer." We just heard that the younger Worker will obey the older, and the Friends obey the Workers, and the Workers are under the leading of Holy Spirit and live as Jesus taught in the Bible.
1975 to 1990
The Evacuation until VN again Opened its Doors to Foreigners in Early 1990s
Fred Allen was the Head Worker in Vietnam from 1957 to 1975 when he and all the foreign Workers had to evacuate due to the Communist occupation of South Vietnam. At that time, Fred handed the responsibility for VN over to the native Workers, Vu Ngoc Châu and Nguyễn Thanh Hoa.
Uncle Châu wrote: It’s been over 8 years since you left us, but looking back I see it’s almost recent. We still try to picture out how things were like during this time 8 years ago. I remember one afternoon I sat by myself near the place we put our bikes along the side of Fred’s room. Phyl came to me and you got another chair and sat by my side. You told me you’d have to go and how things would be hard for us, then you gave me some advice. Even until then I still couldn’t believe it’d come true. Then I remember the tearful meetings we had and the goodbyes we said to you. It all seems just like yesterday (May 1, 1983 Letter by Châu)
These two local Workers Nguyễn Thanh Hoa and Vu Ngoc Châu, are respected very much by God’s people. They devotedly took care of the Friends, even in the most difficult times. All who knew Uncle Châu would agree that he is a loving and tender Worker and Overseer. (My family knew Uncle Châu's family when I was just one year old.) At least six Sisters entered the work and stopped; and 3 Sisters remained until the Canadian Workers arrived in the early 1990’s.
We never knew we were under any system of man but GOD’s system given to us in the Bible. After Liberation Day (April 30, 1975, end of Vietnam War) we weren’t able to connect with Workers or Friends around the world…till Cliff Toane came in 1992 (18 years later).
Cliff Toane took the oversight of Vietnam and Châu and Hoa cooperated with him. Cliff was from Canada and was preaching in Hong Kong. Right after Cliff’s visit (1992) and report, Uncle Fred wrote a letter on 14th February 1993. By chance we had this copy...Here is a part of it...
After discussing the Vietnamese question with Cliff Toane,
...We have greatly appreciated all that Hoa and Châu had done there these 18 years since the Workers left there. Cliff has been very pleased with all he has found...
... So while Cliff can go in and out he will have the general oversight.
... Châu will be responsible if Cliff not able to be there.
copies of the above forwarded to:
LINK to TMB Thread
From 1992 to 1999, Cliff Toane and Jim Chafee came to Vietnam for very brief visits, “sometimes in a year, both of them couldn’t stay even one month!” During those years, Châu was the designated responsible Overseer. However, the Overseers ruled from afar.
In 1997, Cliff Toane’s health failed and the responsibility for VN went to Jim Chafee, originally from South Dakota, USA and the Overseer of China, which included Vietnam, and Hong Kong. Sadly, after a few visits, he (Cliff) disappeared...much later we found out he went back to Canada and married.
When Jim Chafee left, Vietnam became a separate jurisdiction from China and the Canadians assumed the Overseership of VN, and that was when the present trouble began. Jim Chafee is now preaching in South Africa.
The Canadian Overseers Arrive
In the early 1990s the government opened the doors to the country, and two Canadian Workers, Darrel Turner and Morris Grovum could stay in Vietnam under the name of learning, teaching or working...but not preaching. The word “Overseer” was first heard by us at this time. Reportedly, one Worker gave “Missionary” as the reason he wanted to enter Vietnam and was denied entry. The Canadian Workers fields are shown on the Canadian Workers List as "Far East."
At first when the foreign Workers came, everyone welcomed them because they came as helpers to local Workers. Gradually though, the foreign Workers began to have more influence owing to they had a lot of money and spent a lot of money to rent apartments, restaurants, transportation, etc. They exclusively decided to call and approve new Workers (recruit the workers). At last we were surprised to find that the native Workers were in charge of the church only on paper (in front of the authorities), and that the real power is in the hands of foreign Workers. The gradual transition was transparent.
Mr. Bram, a professing Australian businessman helped the Workers get into Vietnam after it went to a market economy in the late 1980's. When the Canadian Workers first came to Vietnam, an Australian Elder Friend opened an English school in HàNội, to support these Canadian Workers. The school operated only a few years then closed. We don't know the name of the school and why it is closed, because it was in the north and we live in the south. The school owner is a businessman, his name is Bram. He is a very godly, friendly and very close Friend of ours, coming to our house many times, and he also came to our daughter’s wedding.
In early 1995, the responsibility for the Oversight of Vietnam was assumed by Darrel Turner from Alberta, Canada. A few years later, in 1999, Morris Grovum also from Canada went to Vietnam. Morris was born in 1943 in Saskatchewan and started in the work in there in 1969, and remained there (except for 2 years in Alberta 1986-1988) until he went to VN. He returned to Canada sometime before 2012 for health reasons.
Soon after they arrived, the Canadian Overseers, Morris G. and Darrel T. began to use their authority to change many things, without discussing anything with Châu and Hoa! When the Canadians first came here we thought they came to help the local Workers, but gradually we see that they are overthrowing the leadership of Uncles Châu and Hoa. The Overseers told the younger Workers not to listen to Uncle Châu, who labored for a long time in this country. One day Uncle Châu was asked to give some advice to some young Sister Workers. Uncle Châu replied, ‘They do not obey my advice any more. They just obey Darrel T. You may speak direct to him.’ Day by day we learn that there is a power over us by these new Overseers!!!
From February, 2011 until the present (2014), Lyle Shultz from Saskatchewan, Canada has been overseeing VN. Lyle had been preaching in India, and it is not known how long he will remain in VN. He is the brother of Dale Shultz, the Western USA Overseer.
In 2014, both Uncles Châu and Hoa are 73 years old and have been professing for 52 years; and both men had been in the Work since 1967.
CHAPTER 2 - 2000 to 2013
The Changing Time by Overseers
The Vietnam government controls and monitors all forms of public gatherings, including assemblies for religious activities. The government asked us to stop big gatherings without their permission.After the foreign Workers came and took over there could be no conventions because they entered Vietnam by travelling visa or for learning Vietnamese. Foreign preachers are not permitted to preach or hold a Convention. The Workers began holding Special Meetings, two Meetings on a Sunday in January and July in North VN and also South VN. The Special Meetings are referred to as session of classes where the Workers are the teachers or the Teaching Staff, and the Friends are students. In those months, the Workers go on Special Meeting tours in North VN and then go to South VN.
Beginning in December, 2006, all the VN Workers went to Hong Kong for Convention with some friends (1 or 2 some time, but not every time). The Friends started going to Conventions held in other countries, such as Singapore; Port Dickson and Penang, Malaysia; and Cambodia. Many cannot afford to go. There someone translated the speaker’s words into Vietnamese, and the VN Friends used ear-phones to listen. Each year there would be no Workers in Vietnam for one month, while all the Workers went abroad twice a year for Convention tours. They were able to spend one week at each Convention. Before 2006, the VN Workers also went to Convention in Hong Kong, but the VN Friends didn’t.
If the Friends attend a Convention, they must fly to another country where they hear another language and meet with people they don’t know and can’t communicate with! This is very expensive and doesn’t come close to the satisfaction of attending a Convention with Friends in their own country.
However, this may be changing. Reportedly a session of classes was held during a weekend in January, 2014 at a hotel in Hoi An which is a tourist town located in central VN, where some Sister Workers have a bach and foreigners would not be out of place.
Ten Examples of Changes Made by Canadian Overseers
In 2000, the Canadian Workers such as Morris Grovum, Darrel Turner, and Lyle Shultz, began to do some things that were not guided by the Spirit of God, and the situation got worse and worse! They changed and changed as they went! The Workers used their authority to cut, to add, and to teach some things that are not right. This caused disagreements with those who weren’t willing for their changes.
The Elders prepared a list of questions about ten procedures the Overseers had changed. They concerned sitting vs. standing to take part in Meeting; when and how to hold Bible studies; what time to hold Fellowship Meetings; helping out with material things; young people’s Meetings; not eating blood; weddings, funerals, division of VN into fields, and Canadian Workers living in wealthy style. (View full list in Appendix)
It wasnot these unimportant things that caused the split. The important thing was their deeds such as changing this or that were not done in the Spirit of God. And we didn't see the love among the Workers. They spoke ill of each other. In one case, a couple of companions Workers didn't talk to each other although they were living in the same apartment. ‘By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another’ (John 13:35). The Canadian Overseer belittled the two native Workers. We all saw these things. So how could we continue trusting this system? They preached the love of God but we didn't see the love among them, so how could we listen to their words? Mr. Bau wrote: The main point was that they didn’t give us the good examples that we had seen in the life of Workers before.
Some people, and in particular women, in some far Eastern countries are keen to latch on to Western men. In comparison to their own people, they perceive them to be wealthy. Western men in places like the Philippines, Thailand, Vietnam, etc. have to be careful around women who are only interested in them for the perceived benefits. It is sometimes their only hope or dream of getting a better life.
The Canadian Workers show off their money by riding very expensive motorbikes and living in expensive apartments. They portray themselves as wealthy (big shot) businessmen who invite people to eat in restaurants. No friends in VN ride expensive motorbikes as they do. We are very afraid for their security, because robbers often attack and kill people riding the SH motorbike.
There were some women who followed them because they thought these Workers were businessmen. One time two ladies met them, and the older said to the younger, ‘The old man is mine, and the other young man is yours.’ And they tried to approach them! (these two ladies are now married to foreigners outside.)
Flaunting their wealth attracts many young people to come to practice their English and causes young Friends to want to become Workers. I'm sure that if Darrel did not show an easy and comfortable life as a Worker, going abroad very often, that VN would not be crowded with Workers like it is now, and with more waiting to go out! Seeing Darrel Turner riding on SH motorbike, one Brother Friend said "I wish I were a Worker so I could have a motorbike like this. With the price of this SH, the government can build ten loving houses for poor people."
The Young People’s Meeting
Xuan Hoan: After our wedding in 1979, my wife came to Dalat with me where we lived for 24 years. In 2002 we moved to Saigon. One of the joys of our family when returning to Saigon was that we often had Fellowship Meetings with many Friends and often had Workers besides to take care of. At that time in Saigon alone, there were six Workers, split into three fields. I also thought that our children's spiritual lives benefited by the move.
The young Friends were often gathered by overseer. About ten years ago, our family had just moved to Saigon, and a gathering was held at the home of my youngest sister-in-law. My son was invited to attend that gathering through mobile phone message together with his other cousins.
My father-in-law was very enthusiastic, caring about all activities in God's way. He had many grandchildren, and he always said: "My wish is to see the grandchildren choose the best things…such as offering their lives for God's work." And my father-in-law, as well as my little sister-in-law's family, hoped very much her eldest daughter had that wish. (Now, my father-in-law directly told her to marry.)
But regrettably, this particular gathering reserved for young Friends disturbed the spirit, not only of our son, but also ours as parents. We did not know the subject of that gathering until the problem happened. The next day my little sister-in-law boomingly came to my parents in-law, and retold the whole content of that gathering. My sister-in-law told my father that our son had destroyed the godly spirit of the gathering for young Friends. After he finished listening, my father-in-law hastily rode the motorbike to my house and immediately called my son out to reprove him.
Of course, my son felt hurt, which was inherently of few words. Later he said to us, "From now on, don't call me to attend young Friends' gathering any more.”
We asked each person thoroughly about the gathering. My wife was especially very worried and asked about the young people who were preparing to go to work such as Cuong and Hai (now they are Workers). Turned out that it was a gathering in which the Overseer (Darrel T.) asked each young Friend to utter their wishes and future plans. Almost all the young Friends expressed their wish to choose the best thing, offering their life to God. Only our son said, "I wish to have a beautiful wife, to buy a car and build a house with many floors…!"
According to my sister-in-law, the thought expressed by her nephew of three generations in the Truth was a shame, and she named many young Friends in other families who spoke beautiful and godly words, which made my father-in-law angry.
In order to resolve the problem, at a meal my wife softly asked our son. He only answered succinctly: "They are my real wishes. They asked me to express my heart, and I had to say what was really in my heart. They felt I am not godly. Please don't ask me to attend the young Friends' gathering any more."
In our opinion, we didn't blame our son because he had expressed from his real heart when he was asked. And we have drawn a conclusion that it is easy to become a hypocrite in an organisation because people want to hear beautiful words, rather than real heart words.
It's no wonder Darrel Turner has been praised for the large number of young Vietnamese people who have or want to go in the work while he has been the VN Overseer. In many third world countries--Vietnam, Philippines, India, Korea and other countries--a country girl or boy barely out of high school can suddenly become a respected "Teacher" (Worker) without any training and enjoy a reasonably good life style as long as he or she obeys the instructions of their senior companion and their overseer. With little firsthand Bible knowledge or experience, they can repeat the teachings they’ve heard from the foreign workers. So of course, there is usually a waiting list of wannabe workers/teachers in third world countries.
Hunger and poverty in Vietnam has existed for a significant amount of time. Until the 1980s, most of the Vietnamese population still lived under the poverty line. It is estimated that about 28 million people have been lifted out of poverty over the last two decades. By the end of 2010, the status of poverty and hunger in Vietnam had improved significantly. VN went from being one of the poorest countries in the world to a lower middle income country. The wages differ greatly between those living in the country and those in the cities.
Darrel told us not to use the word "lao khổ," and instead to use "lao sướng." "Lao khổ" means the Worker uses all his/her effort to seek the lost sheep wherever they are and live a model life to show Christ through their life. The word "lao sướng" isn't even in the Vietnamese dictionary. Darrel coined it to emphasize that the young folks who go in the Work will be sure to have an easy life as he has.
The Workers in Uncle Fred's time lived in humble houses or apartments. They went to the market and prepared meals by themselves. They wore normal clothes and travelled by common motorbike. We saw the clear purpose in their life and the love of other souls and the bringing of Gospel to people. By contrast now, the Workers live in expensive apartments and we don't see the love for others, not even love among themselves! Darrel came to Ha Noi first, of course, with much money, showing a very wealthy life for those who followed the 2x2 system. He attracted many young people who came and professed in the beginning. Almost of them quit after a few years. Not only a lot of people professed, but also a lot Friends are on queue waiting for their turn to become a worker.
Many young students follow because Morris invited them to the restaurant.
One time Uncle Châu asked a student, "What is the reason you come to listen?" The answer, “I can enjoy very good food and practise speaking in English.” For this reason a lot of young people came, and Morris G. said, “The fish automatically jump into the net. We don't need to catch them.” I have seen people fishing with the small net. To attract the fish, they put something (bait) in their net that the fish want to eat. The Canadian Workers do the same. They attract people to profess and friends to go into the work with many things they desire. Then they became a boss with full of power upon them. Yet the Workers criticized Uncle Châu saying he used money in order to have affection (money as the bait to fish), and so his converts were not perfect. They were like fish with a hook in their mouth that were torn. In the North, many young students professed in the beginning, but nearly all of them who followed for a short time then stopped. The number of students professing in the North is now around 20.
Another big change: The Workers began asking for meals. These arrangements are something new organized by the Canadian Overseers. In the past Workers never asked for a meal. They just came to have the meal if the Friends wanted to invite them. Asking and appointing a date for Friends to serve them a meal isn’t convenient for some Friends because they are poor, some are too old to cook, and some don't know how to cook andserve meal for the Workers with their highest respect. Some friends in the countryside are so poor they had to borrow money for the meal. Some Sister Friends have told me how much they worry every time they received the arrangement asking for Workers' meal. In another place seeing the Canadian Workers visit to a very poor lady with two children, immediately the authority in that region cut off the welfare for the poor to that family, making their life become more difficult. I mentioned these things with Uncle Lyle one time.
Darrel recommended that when someone loans an amount of money to another, the loaner should consider it as a gift. And when someone wants to borrow an amount of money, he should go to the bank to borrow it. Darrel advised God’s people not to loan money to each other. But in our country, when someone wants to borrow money at the bank, they have to mortgage their house or their field. And some of the Friends don’t own anything. Jesus said: Give to the one who begs from you, and do not refuse the one who would borrow from you. (Matthew 5:42) John wrote: But whoever has the world's goods, and sees his brother in need and closes his heart against him, how does the love of God abide in him? Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth. ( 1 John 3:17-18)
Our Daughter’s Wedding
My daughter fell in love with a good person in life. Just only one thing made him become bad in "2x2" eyes as mine. That was that he wasn't a professing man. Many times we persuaded our daughter to wait until finding a Friend in the Fellowship suitable for her. There were some young Friends wanting to marry her, but there were some little differences that we could not get over.
It was her second year in University. I persuaded her to fulfill her study first. Because it was very hard for us to support her study, we had managed our best for her to study. Not only us, but she also worked at night time and on weekends as a processing worker in the same place where I was working. All the payment went for her study first.
The harder she worked and studied, the more precious she became in her friend's eyes. It also appeared that he was worthy of her too. But in spite of all their effort, in our 2x2 eyes, my daughter should not marry a person outside The Truth. After hearing some advice from Uncle Châu, we tried to prevent them. I followed her closely every time I could which made my daughter become sad and depressed. She didn't want to talk with us, cried quietly with her sadness for months. When my daughter graduated and went to work, I couldn't control her anymore.
Not passive like our daughter, her more active friend faced us and asked, "We love each other. We have proven that we are worthy to be one in love. Many other parents want me to marry their daughter, why don’t you? What is wrong in me that causes you prevent our love? While the whole society agrees and support to us?"
Of course, we couldn't find any wrongness in his manner, except he wasn't in our Fellowship. In spite of our prevention, they were successful in keeping their love alive for 6 years!!!
With the support of relatives on both my and my husband's sides, we finally agreed for my daughter to marry, because they were both worthy with their love. Believing in their love won our favor and both of them prepared much for a wedding and their new life.
Then it was time to persuade the Workers for their wedding. I didn't want to lose my daughter. Of course, no Workers performed the wedding service, but I asked Morris G. (the Overseer who was in our field) to give us a chance to invite the Friends and Workers to the wedding feast for one day only before my daughter's wedding, so Friends could know and meet my daughter and my son-in-law too.
Morris heard my plan and agreed. We went on to fulfill our plans. Everything was settled. Then I received a phone call from Uncle Châu (Neither Uncle Châu or Uncle Hoa were staying in Saigon at that time, and neither were present at my daughter's wedding). Uncle Châu informed me that we shouldn't invite Friends to my daughter's wedding. I asked the reason why. He said others would do the same--marry people outside. He told us that the Workers were going to prevent Friends from coming--even though Morris had agreed earlier and we had everything already arranged and money already paid for the feast.
Disappointed and seeing we were not worthy to be in the Fellowship because we had agreed for our daughter to marry a person outside, I said to uncle Chau; "I can't bear with things happening like this, I can not continue in this way...I would better stop now!!!"
However, I really didn't mean that I wanted to leave or stop. I said that just because I felt very sad with the way the Workers were going back on their agreement and our discussion about my daughter's wedding feast. I said that because I felt unworthy to be in the Perfect Way, and was deeply saddened because my daughter was marrying an unprofessing man. Now, it was my turn to be depressed and sad.
Since we were for a long time in close cooperation with Workers in unity, loved the Friends and respected the Workers; and also seeing the wedding plans were all settled, and maybe being afraid I may stop in the Way because of sadness, the Workers finally agreed for Friends to come. Uncle Châu asked Mr. Bram to come as well, to comfort us. (Mr. Bram had come to the South that day).
Through time, they have proved their worthiness and true love together. My son-in-law is not only a good person in society, but also a very loving husband with his wife, and a wonderful father in his children's eye and in our eyes too. Writing this, I regret that I prevented their love in the past, but maybe going through hard times in love, they value the happiness more that they struggled for.
Now there arose up a new king over Egypt, which knew not Joseph. (Exodus 1:8 KJV)
I think the main reason that caused Darrel to want to chase Uncle Châu out of the work, was because he didn't obey this rule of organization. Uncles Châu and Hoa both used to visit all the country after all the foreigners had to leave VN after 1975. Their fields were the whole country. And they continue to visit our Friends in the countryside. The native Workers had been going where the Spirit led them and where they felt there was a need. Sometimes, they traveled together and sometimes they went their separate ways in order to visit the Friends more often. However, the other Workers stayed together in pairs when they traveled and always lived in baches.
After Convention Uncles Châu and Hoa used their free time to visit Friends in their need, while the rest of the Workers went to the resort in the Highland, to the beach, or visit their families. One time an old man who knew Uncles Châu and Hoa through years was waiting for their coming to profess. Instead of having the joy of a professing, the Sisters in that field became very angry because Uncle Châu ‘trampled on their field!’ They still disagreed even after he explained the situation to them, and said that he learned all these things from Uncle Fred.
The Overseers also don't want Uncle Châu helping the poor VN Friends. They said that he used money or material goods to seduce Friends. But it is not right not to help poor Friends in their need! In the past some of the Elders also received the help from the local Workers. We did not receive any help from local Workers but still respected them with our whole heart. The way the foreign Workers think and speak about this is all wrong and not according to what the Bible teaches! For there will never cease to be poor in the land. Therefore I command you, ‘You shall open wide your hand to your brother, to the needy and to the poor, in your land.’ (Deuteronomy 15:11)
In 2007 when Châu went to the USA on a tour of Conventions (read full letter in Appendix) he met ex-Worker Nathan Barker, who is a native Vietnamese now residing in Oregon. Nathan warned him against the Telling The Truth website and about the man who founded the Meetings named William Irvine. Nathan felt sure the internet information about the 2x2 history would someday reach the Vietnamese friends, and he wanted to prepare Uncle Châu for this event; i.e.to poison the well.
Châu doesn't believe the 2x2 church was started by Wm. Irvine, nor does he accept that the Workers church was started by a man about 100 years ago in Ireland. It is doubtful that Châu has read about the beginning of 2x2 church. Uncle Châu admonished me many times. "Please, don't waste your time on internet; reading many things there you may lose your soul!" My reply was "On internet we not only find out many things good for our decision, but also have had sweet Fellowship throughout the world, with love and understanding." Although he is afraid to contact us by email, we still send him news posted on the internet relating to VN situation. There is good reason to believe that Uncle Châu’s email was hacked and possibly still is.
Hoàn and Minh Thanh Offer to Buy “Châu’s House”
“Uncle Châu has a House, while being a Worker”
After 1982 we didn’t have any gatherings at the Brother’s bach. They stopped renting that place because of high rent and no Meetings were being held there anymore. So it became useless. Uncle Châu’s family had arranged a place for Châu and Hoa. It was a house that belonged to Châu’s youngest brother, Mr. Vũ Trung Hiền who was living in the USA. The government entry (registration) showed this house as Hoa and Châu’s registered family book.
In 2009 Darrell sent Uncle Hoa to Cambodia and Uncle Châu to Central VN, and then to the North of Vietnam. In February, 2010, Uncle Chau was chased out of his work. Now it is clear to me the reason why uncle Hoa want to get rid of "Cái tròng", (similar to a yoke, collar or noose). A few months later, after careful and deep thinking, Uncle Hoa sacrificed his place of being a worker to ring the bell for the safety of the flock. Uncles Châu and Hoa didn’t stay much time in Saigon. The house was closed very often. Châu sent the key to a young Friend for checking in the house some time.
Uncles Châu and Hoa’s registered family book was at this house with the government till now. The address of the Friends and Workers Fellowship Christian Mission in Vietnam is registered at that address also. That is one more reason Uncle Châu refused to allow the house to be sold. It’s very important in Vietnam that every citizen be able to prove where they are with the government. And that’s why there was a rumor “Uncle Châu has a house while being a Worker.”
In early 2009, when Uncle Châu had some spare time, he returned to Saigon to repair the house, in order that some Friends from the countryside could stay there. They were students and civil services, and had to rent a small room at a very expensive price. Some young Friends helped him, including Mr. Mãnh (DiLinh Elder). They all worked together for Châu very good desire. Everything was done to the joy of friends. On the day Uncle Châu had to be back to the North for his laboring, my father and Elder Mãnh were there to say goodbye to him. Darrel also came and uttered, “This house has to sell!” Trouble begins!
The following details concern the transfer of ownership of a house owned by Châu’s brother Vũ Trung Hiền to Xuân Hoàn and Nguyễn Minh Thanh.
Darrel failed to properly research this matter. He acted on assumptions or hearsay, and the result was disaster and the fallout continues until this day. He erroneously believed that the house was owned by Châu, when in fact it was owned by Châu’s brother Vũ Trung Hiềnwho lives in America. Darrel also mistakenly thought Châu was giving the house to Xuân Hoàn and Minh Thanh as a gift, when they were actually buying the house. As a result of Darrel not verifying the facts surrounding the ownership and the sale of the home, he caused much pain, hurt, grief, separation, betrayal and loss to the church. Ultimately, Darrel caused and is responsible for the Division of the Friends and Workers in Vietnam.
We agreed to buy the house. Immediately I phoned to Uncle Châu in Hanoi. He felt very happy for us to buy the house for many reasons. With Darrel’s permission, we bought an air plane ticket for Uncle Châu to come back to Saigon for a discussion. We really wanted to buy Mr Hiền’s house, but we didn’t have enough money yet. (Remember Mr. Hiền is Uncle Châu’s youngest brother, and he is the real owner of the house.)
There were three obstacles to overcome before Xuân Hoàn and Minh Thanh could buy Mr. Hiền’s house. (1) They had entered into a 3-year contract to rent the home they were living in, and only two months had passed. The penalty for breaking the rental contract was $2,500 USD. They needed to wait until the contracted ended. (2) They had to sell their house in Dalat in order to have enough money to buy Uncle Châu's brother’s house. This would take time. (3) They needed to earn additional money to purchase the house. It was decided that the Friends would stay in the house as Châu had agreed and after three years, Hoàn and Minh Thanh would purchase the house.
Suddenly, Darrel made an appointment to meet with us. We five were sitting together: Darrel, Colin Brodie, Châu, Hoàn and Minh Thanh. Darrel started the conversation by looking at me (MT) and asked the question: “How do you feel, when receiving a gift from a Worker worth $80,000 USD?
We were all shocked with Darrel’s question. We didn’t know why he asked that question. It wasn’t Uncle Châu’s house, so how could he give it to me? While we were still sitting there surprised, Darrel continued, “This morning I searched the internet and saw the price of selling the house is $80,000 USD.” Uncle Châu had never made us a price (maybe he waited for his brother’s decision?) But Darrel had already searched and announced the price in a strange way.
I explained to him that we invited Uncle Châu back here to discuss buying the house-- not to receive a gift. We would never take the house as a gift for we didn’t want our children being made a sinner in case they would sell the house when we passed away. There were four reasons that we wanted to buy the house:
1. I was tired of moving house to house, since we moved from Dalat to Saigon.
2. I wanted to live near my parents, so I could look after them because they are getting old.
3. We wanted to keep the registered family book for Châu and Hoa, so they could continue stay there with us any time they returned to Saigon.
4. Two big families (Vu & Nguyễn) have held a close relationship for more than 50 years. My grandmother was a friend of Uncle Châu’s parents. His brothers and sisters were also my parents’ friends, and now Uncle Châu’s nieces have become members of the Nguyễn’s family. One is Mr. Hiền’s daughter. So we wanted to buy this house so we would have the opportunity to welcome them whenever they (Châu’s relatives) came back to VN for visiting.
Later we and many young Friends had a gathering for singing before Uncle Châu left to go to Hanoi again. He made an announcement to more than 20 friends that: “Hoàn and Minh Thanh are the first candidates to offer to buy this house.” Uncle Châu also permitted some Friends to move in and stay there for three years as we had discussed.
Unfortunately, things did not go as smoothly as we wished. When Uncle Châu went back to Hanoi, the Sister Workers came and ordered the Friends out, “No one can stay here.” They prevented the Friends from coming in to stay (maybe Darrel's orders?) While the two Sister Workers were in the South, there was an email sent to Uncle Châu’s inbox that gave him a very bad headache. It s aid: “Please don’t sell the house to Hoàn and Thanh because it should wait until three years.” (Because of this email, we didn’t continue to buy that house). There was another couple who wanted to buy the house for their younger sister (the wife is my relative too). From that time we didn’t mind anything happening to the house.
When Uncle Hoa returned from Cambodia, he was terribly sad to inform to Uncle Châu who was in China that the Friend who wanted to buy the house had moved out everything in the house, and many papers and precious belongings were lost. This was very sad to our local Workers. We had no idea why this was done. They had asked Uncle Châu for permission to come in and they hadn’t even paid any money yet. That was the first reason Uncle Châu no longer wanted to sell the house to them. Uncle Châu warned them, ‘Don’t touch any things belonging to Uncle Hoa.’
After the Special Meeting, we invited Uncle Châu to stay with us for a few days. At this time, he had been 42 years in the field. We were going to have a meal for family only and Uncle Châu. We were thankful to God for keeping him faithful in the work of God. This was also the day our landlady of the house we were renting informed us that she would like to take the house back and she would compensate us as in the contract. I felt terribly sad and worried. Uncle Châu was there and witnessed everything happening to us. We had to accept the compensation money, but it made me tired to think of moving again!
Seeing and understanding the situation, Uncle Châu said they should buy his brother’s house. Minh Thanh refused because she didn’t want to dispute with her relatives, so Uncle Châu offered to phone and explain the situation to them.
Every thing would have been OK if the Workers had not interfered in the business--especially the Sister Workers! Of course, the Sister Workers would not have been doing anything wrong if the bad stories had not been started by Darrel. He not only started bad rumors with his staff but also to the Elders. And they believed him because he was an Overseer. The Workers caused many problems and made up many bad stories about Uncle Châu. They wanted to smear Uncle Châu and in doing so they also caused a family much unhappiness by spreading the lie that Uncle Châu had particular love with someone which caused their husband to be upset.
We asked for a Meeting with us, Uncle Châu and my relative. We had asked Nhung (a Vietnamese Sister Friend), Darrel and even an Overseer to please come and solve the problem as the Bible teaches. ‘ If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector.’ (Mathew 18:15-17)
My relative came to me and told me that from the bottom of her heart she wasn’t sad with us; that Darrel and the Sister Workers had said there was problem. It wasn’t her saying so. Even though we asked them to have the gathering to solve the problem, they never would hold a gathering as we asked! They didn’t want to obey the teaching in the Bible. Here you see the problem was caused by the Workers! Darrel with his staff came and questioned us many times in order to discourage us to not buy the house. However, we continued buying the house, in spite of whether Darrel agreed or not. It wasn’t his house!
A Buyer for Hoàn & Minh Thanh’s House in Dalat
For 20 years we lived in Dalat, a small city 300 km far from Saigon, which is in the highlands with mountains, lakes, waterfalls, flowers…and the weather is cool throughout the year. People often come to Dalat for their honeymoon. Our honeymoon a little longer…25 years! Our children were born and raised there until we moved to Saigon. We still kept the house for a couple Friends to live in, and we welcomed Friends and Workers to come and stay there also.
We didn’t have enough money to buy Mr. Hiền’s house in Saigon, so we had to sell our house in Dalat. I had asked my relatives and friends to buy it, but no one wanted. At last I put an advertisement in the newspaper for selling.
Hearing the trouble that had come to Uncle Châu, a Sister Friend in Phu Quoc Island, Mrs. Mai, wanted to meet with him. They had an appointment to meet at our house. While waiting for Uncle Châu, we were talking together (my husband, the Sister Friend and me), about out plans to sell our house in Dalat.
Mrs. Mai surprised us by saying she would like buy to our house. I was very surprised and happy that she wanted to buy our house. We had no idea she would want to do this. We had hoped to sell to Friends so we could have a short visit to the house whenever we returned to Dalat. The reason Mrs. Mai gave for wanting to buy our house was: “So the Workers could stay there . That was the useful house for many years. I want to offer that house to God for the work in VN. Friends could stay there sometimes if they need to restore their health too.”We reached an agreement and only the three of us knew anything about it. We took the house off the market.
Hoàn and Minh Thanh moved into Mr. Vu Hiền’s house on September 2, 2009 and totally remodeled it. They signed the contract three months later on December 3, 2009 and paid a down payment to Mr. Vu Hiền.
Darrell puts out of the work the Oldest Vietnamese Sister Worker, Miss Mai Hoa
While Darrel was the Overseer, a lovely Sister native Worker, Miss Mai Hoa, met with a lot of trouble with her companions. She is the oldest Vietnamese Sister Worker now. She still respects our two native Workers as before, and never has there been a word of criticism come from her mouth. We all still love and respect her as ever. But she is very afraid to meet us--even by accident, or to take our phone calls when her companion is there beside her! She is in her late sixties now.
One time she and her younger companion disagreed. The younger Worker reported the matter to Darrel at my relative’s house. She thought that the landlord couldn't understand her; however, the daughter in that family heard and understood all the details.
We were very disappointed when Darrel made Miss Mai Hoa leave the work after that. After two years she was restored to the work and now she is under the control of her younger companion, the same as Uncle Châu is. This is a shame for both of them.
Workers Interfere with House Sale in Dalat
While Uncle Hoa was leading a secluded life at our house in Dalat, there were three Overseers from Philippines Korea and Pakistan who came to “solve the problem,” and Cường, a Vietnamese young Brother Worker always translates for them.Two times my family was especially glad to receive these three Overseers who knew my family was closely connected with the two local Workers, Uncles Châu and Hoa.
One time we were talking, and Uncle Jim Girton, (Philippine Overseer) asked me about Uncle Hoa. Uncle Jim was very gentle and had come to Vietnam during the Golden Time. He valued the mindset of God’s people. Respecting him, I sincerely told him about the house in Dalat, and that I considered it to be a wonderful thing that God had made provision for Uncle Hoa. At that time Mrs. Mai and us had agreed with each other but we hadn’t exchanged any money for the sale of the house in Dalat. We didn’t plan to let others know until all was done. After we finished talking, Uncle Jim was very glad, and said that he worried for Uncle Hoa and now he was calm and happy. Now besides the three of us (Sister Mai, my husband and I), the four Workers also knew about the house reserved for Workers.
A short time after these Overseers returned to their countries, we received a phone call from Mrs. Mai at Phu Quốc island saying, “I don’t know why the two Sister Workers coming to our house and asked if I was forced to buy the house in Dalat. These Workers tried to persuade me not buying the house too. I felt tired and didn't want to talk with them.”When Mrs. Mai asked me how the Workers knew she had wanted to buy the house, I remembered that Cường came to visit with the three Overseers. Cường is the Vietnamese Worker who was Darrel’s companion and right arm. He is very knowledgeable of IT, computers and speaks and translates English. Things became more entangled.
I didn’t know why or who sent these Sister Workers to interfere in selling and buying our house. My daughter was outraged and wanted to take the Workers to court. Even the Overseer didn’t want her to buy our house. I asked Mrs Mai three times if she was sure she wanted to do this, and she still kept her will to buy the house for the Workers and Mrs Mai’s husband also wanted to buy our house. And they did.
We had invited two young Sister Workers in my field (Anne M. & Van) to come for a meal in order to explain to them what was happening with us. It was hard for them to believe the complicated problem caused by the Workers. Anne is a very nice young Sister Worker from Canada. She has a very good relationship with the F&Ws. Previously, we had only heard Mrs. Mai’s side, so Anne called Miss E.M. so we could talk with her. My daughter had the conversation with Miss E.M and we and Workers witnessed it (Anne M. and her companion).
My daughter said to Miss E.M, “Mrs. Mai came to my parents’ house for visiting and wanted to buy the house by her own will. Why did you give the advice to Mrs. Mai to not buy our house in Dalat? With the Vietnamese law, we can bring to court anyone who interferes into other business and causes a problem.” Surprisingly, Miss E.M answered, “I didn’t know that she came to Saigon! It was not me who gave the advice. My young Vietnamese companion gave the advice to her because she knew the Vietnamese law.” My daughter asked to talk to the Vietnamese companion. Miss E.M. said she was not there.
Anne M. then asked me, “Now, who do you believe?” I answered, “The person who is supposed to be worthy of my trust, didn’t make me trust her!” So the Workers in my field went home without providing any solution or help. Anne M. feared to become involved in the Overseer’s work. She emailed to me that “I’m just a young Sister, a new one in VN, so I can’t help you with any advice. Please talk to the Brother (Overseer) about your problem!”
That afternoon and evening, Mrs. Mai and I both received many telephone calls and messages from Miss E.M in order to justify…even after we had gone to sleep! We were very disappointed in these Workers. They didn’t go out to seek the lost sheep (like Uncle Hoa), and interfered with private, material things of others. It made us doubt whether they were true Workers of God.
Although the Workers tried very hard to prevent Uncle Hoa from having a convenient place to stay, they were not successful.
My husband had a stroke two days later, and that was just the beginning of many bad things that would happen later. (Year 2010)
Events of December, 2009
At the Convention at Singapore in December, 2009, Darrel and Morris asked Uncle Châu ‘Do you want to continue in the work or not?’ The answer just ‘Crying.’ Three months later, they would use a false reason to chase Uncle Chau out and make up many bad stories about him.
On 3rd December 2009, when Uncle Châu came back to Saigon from the Singapore Convention, we and Uncle Châu (represented for his brother) signed the contract agreeing to the selling and buying before the government office with the price $80,000 USD. We had moved into the house on 2 nd of September 2009. We had to repair the house completely, because our Uncles lived too simply. On August 28, 2012, after we paid him all the money, Mr. Hiền sent an email to us and also to the Vu’ family members. (View email in Appendix)
The large Elders Meeting was held in March, 2010, three months AFTER the contract was entered into. This was the Meeting where they suspended Châu from the work because the house supposedly wasn’t sold. (View Contract in Appendix)
Since September 9, 2009 my husband and I have lived between two of Uncle Châu’s nieces’ houses (The Vu family). There are four houses belong to Vu' family stand successively. As I had said, our two families have had long relationship since the time in Protestant church. We came to these houses many times for singing and seeing Mr. Hiền's children grow up. Our house at 19 cx Trần Quang Diệu- Ward 14 -Distr 3 - Saigon is still the registered address for the “Christian Mission in Vietnam” church, and also the registered family book of Uncles Châu and Hoa. Sometimes policeman come to our house to ask about Uncle Hoa and Châu because their registered family book is at our house.
2010 Elders Meeting when Châu was Expelled
Dale Shultz, Overseer of the Western Alliance, came for two weeks to help resolve the problems. It was arranged that Tsutomu Miyata (Overseer of Japan) and Simeon Sarmiento (Philippines/Indonesia) would be with Dale during the first week of his trip.
Dale wrote in a summary explanation of his VN visit: We visited with the local men Teachers (including Hoa) concerning Châu. Tsutomu, Simeon and I then visited with Châu. We found Châu quite open to direction and help and we discussed the problem areas that had been presented to us. Later, Darrel, Morris and Hoa were added to the discussion group and a good spirit prevailed in our visiting together…We all were concerned that the very best results could be realized for the Teachers and Students in your country and for Châu's future as well. (View Letter in Appendix)
On March 7, 2010, all the Elders from many provinces and areas went to Saigon for a big meeting of Workers and Elders. All the Workers in the country (except Châu) were present, along with Dale Shultz from Western USA, Tsutomu Miyata from Japan and Simeon Sarmiento from Indonesia. It would become a mourning day for the Vietnamese friends.
The three visiting Workers spoke in the Meeting. They all praised Uncle Châu saying that he was a lovely, friendly and humble Worker. Then they declared "Châu is not in the work anymore.” He had to leave the work for “solving the selling of the house.”From that time he wasn’t allowed to have any activities in the church, not even leading the Meeting. The Friends all fell down in pain. The truth was that the “solving of the selling of the house” had already been solved. The house had sold three months earlier!
Right after they finished their announcement, my husband stood up immediately. Brother Mãnh stood up successively. But Darrel prevented both of them from speaking. This was because they knew for certain that it was A LIE. The paperwork relating to the selling of the house had been completed on December 3, 2009. We had owned the house since that time. This Elders Meeting was held three months later. Uncles Dale and Darrel had just told an outright lie to all the Friends and Workers and guest Workers! (Tsutomu Miyata, Simeon Sarmiento). We were stunned!
Sadly many Workers and Friends believed the lie because it came from the Overseers! They not only believed it, but showing their true colors, they also tried to find other things against our local Workers! We were all very sad that we couldn't speak out, so we prayed earnestly to our Lord. The F&W’s chose various ways to deal with the Workers according to their feelings! We wrote a lot of letters to ask them to make everything right, but it was hopeless!
We gave Mr. Manh, the Elder in DiLinh, the evidence to read. He said ‘Trăm nghe không bằng một thấy’ (One time of seeing equal to one hundred times of hearing). The day after the Elders Meeting, Mr. Manh returned to DiLinh (about 200Km far from Saigon). All w ho had ever met him would agree that he is an Elder as if a Worker. He told the bad news to the Friends there. They all shed tears and decided not to welcome the foreign Workers any more, because of their deceit to the church in driving Uncle Châu out with a lie.
Nothing in their reasons for putting Châu out of the ministry concerned the spiritual! They refused to let us to ask Uncle Châu to lead the Meeting, even when there weren’t any other Workers in the Meeting. Darrel and his staff considered Uncle Châu not worthy and a lay member, like us Friends. At that time there were some Workers who phoned Uncle Châu while he stayed at our house to apologize to him for their leading the Meeting with the presence of Uncle Châu. They knew that Uncle Châu was more worthy to lead the Meeting than they were.
In the following months, day by day, Darrel exposed his malice. Stopping the work of Uncle Châu to “solve the selling of the house” was a lie and an excuse. He wanted to expel Uncle Châu permanently and not accept him back into the work. He made up bad stories and told the Elders as if they were true happenings! My family was a victim also, relating to their finding the way to kick out Uncle Châu, even though we had talked, given evidence and ideas to edify many times. They know their wrongs but they don’t want to correct them.
Dale Shultz only stayed in Vietnam for 1-2 weeks. The Canadian Workers couldn't begin to imagine all the opposition they would be facing! Morris G. asked Uncle Châu for help. Uncle Châu phoned the DiLinh Friends from the North, and advised them to welcome the foreign Workers again. NOW, the Workers wanted the Friends to obey Uncle Châu’s advice even though the Friends still disliked the way they were treating our local Workers!
Some Friends obeyed Uncle Châu’s advice and returned to the Workers group because he said “This is The True Way…God will be sad seeing the separation among the Friends if you have the Fellowship with Hoa, and not with other Workers and Friends.”
Uncle Châu had sent a letter to Friends, with advice from a Worker “Let us obey, even when things happening seem not right…” Reading his letter, I felt terrible. Then I remembered Proverbs 14:12: There is a way which seemeth right unto a man; But the end thereof are the ways of death. I replied to him “Only before God is right or wrong; if anything seems not right, I would like to have an explaining to prove… If it’s right, then I will obey.” I haven’t had any answer!
After being chased out of the work… Uncle Châu returned to Saigon stayed at our house some days, then went to stay with his niece's family until they all left Viet Nam to America. Uncle Chau spent long time at Mr Đức house, a poor friend, just lost his wife and his son, his health also wasn’t good. Uncle Châu chose to stay with him for encouraging and helping him in both spiritual and natural life. Uncle Châu stayed there nearly one year, until the police of that region didn’t permit for him to stay. The reason was uncle Chau has his registered residence at our house, so he needed to stay at our house where being easy for the government to control.
Then uncle Châu came back to our house, while uncle Hoa was also staying at our house for treatment. Uncle Hoa’s leg was fractured from an accident. We always remember that wonderful time. We studied the Bible together each morning, sometimes sang hymns at night. Many friends came and visited both of them. Seeing Uncle Hoa, then Uncle Châu both returned and stayed with us, maybe the Canadian overseers felt very worried. They asked Uncle Châu to come to stay with Moris and Cường (Tim), where it would be easy for them to control or look after him! Uncle Châu felt sad when leaving our home on June 21, 2011. Staying with them as an interpreter only. This was a very sad time in his life. Trying to completely obey all the overseer’s rules with humility.
Poor Uncle Châu is torn in four directions with the situation he is facing right now: his family, his Overseer and his staff, the government, and the Golden Friends. What a pity for Uncle Châu.
Châu is Reinstated in the Work
They temporarily restored Chau to the work on November 29, 2011. With great pleasure Uncle Châu had announced to us Uncle Dale’s decision for him. He could: “ … go back into the field and could choose to labor in Vietnam or USA.” Uncle Châu replied, “I’ll go wherever you arrange for me.”
Dale’s choice was for Châu to go to the USA.Châu was very happy to have a place in the work, and going to USA was a great privilege for him, since there are a lot of Vietnamese friends living in USA, as well as all his immediate family members and other relatives. We were surprised to hear the news from Uncle Darrel’s staff that “Uncle Châu had to go to USA to learn how to labor in the work!”
Uncle Dale hired a lawyer to handle the paperwork for Uncle Châu. The first interview by the USA consulate failed. They tried again. Uncle Châu was directed carefully in detail from an American lawyer. Uncle Châu came to our house to talk on the telephone with the lawyer from the guest room. The second interview failed also. We were happy that he would be staying and laboring in VN, as Uncle Dale had said in the beginning “Where do you want to labor? Vietnam or USA.”
However, Uncle Dale didn’t allow Uncle Châu back to the work in VN as he had informed Uncle Châu. This was the first time I saw two faces in a matter from Uncle Dale. Instead Dale sent Uncle Châu to Cambodia: “As you know, Châu has again been reinstated to a teaching role and is helping Lloyd [Morgan] in Cambodia. We are thankful that he has this further opportunity.” Uncle Chau had been out of the work for about 19 months.
Uncle Châu is now in the work under the control of Lyle Shultz. The Workers pushed him out of the country to Cambodia, then to East Timor and then to Australia--while he is needed in VN very much. Some friends visited him in Cambodia, and when they returned they said Uncle Châu couldn't speak Khmer, so he taught English for many young boys and girls and was like a babysitter. His companion is an Australian Worker, Lloyd who is young enough to be Uncle Châu’s son, but Lyle sent Uncle Châu to be under Lloyd's control. This is a shame!
Some Vietnamese friends could visit him, Cambodia has the same border as Vietnam. It is easy for the Friends to visit Uncle Châu in Cambodia since the Vietnamese are free to go to a Southeast Asian country. Very easily just with our passport, the limit according to the nation permitted. Maybe 1, 3, 6 months or 1 year. At the end of the limit we go out then return the day after, we have a new limit.
So they sent Uncle Châu farther away, to East Timor, where they don't speak English--they speak Tetun, a local dialect and Portuguese. This country allows visa only 6 months. East Timor is an incredibly poor country not too far from Darwin in northern Australia. It was originally occupied by the Portuguese. East Timor has not had 2x2 Workers but in the past 2 to 3 years Ian Taylor from South Australia has gone there and is learning Tetun, the local language. Prior to Ian's arrival there have been no professing folk in East Timor. The country has a Roman Catholic heritage and there are a number of Bible based churches there. It would be a very difficult environment for Uncle Châu in East Timor.
Before going to East Timor, Uncle Châu visited our DiLinh Friends with Doctor Trung, an Elder. Châu gave them many advice in tears, but he couldn't change their mind. They loved Uncle Châu so much, but they couldn't put their souls under the leading of an Overseer without the love, honesty, compassion and image of Jesus Christ.
After 6 months in East Timor, Lyle Shultz sent Uncle Châu to Australia on a Convention tour there. However, he was absent too long from VN, and the policeman asked him to return. In January, 2014, he returned to Vietnam and Lyle Shutlz planned for him to go to Cambodia again. However, the VN government saw differently and Uncle Châu was required to stay in VN. In out country we have an idiom: "Mưu sự tại nhân, thành sự tại thiên": Man proposes, God disposes.
2010 - The Workers Meeting; Uncle Hoa Resigns and Sends his Heart Letter
About four months after the Elders Meeting announcing Uncle Châu was no longer a Worker, it was Special Meeting time. Darrel had a big box fixed behind every Worker’s motorbike. The box was too clumsy for Uncle Hoa to use since he is so small, so he removed it. Darrel scolded him in front of many Friends and Workers and ordered him to reinstall it. This was just one incident when Darrel publicly shamed Uncle Hoa and flaunted his power over trivial matters regarding Uncles Hoa and Châu. After Special Meeting in a Workers’ Meeting, Darrel continued to talk not right about Uncle Châu, and at this time, Uncle Hoa made a decision in his heart.
It was in the middle of the year 2010 after the Special Meeting that Uncle Hoa decided to leave. He was going to visit Friends and preach the Gospel to the lost around the country. He didn’t take part in any Conventions or Special Meetings. When Uncle Hoa phoned us to explain his decision to not continue to labor as before, we were horrified and cried. When we told Uncle Châu, he phoned Uncle Hoa and just said, “May God be with you.” When Uncle Hoa decided to release cái tròng (similar to a yoke, collar or noose), it was a great shock to Darrel and his staff. Everything was in an upheaval, and no one knew where it would go!
When he resigned from being in the Worker’s organisation in 2010, Uncle Hoa was 70 years old and had been in the Work for 43 years, since 1967.
Uncle Hoa wrote: For many years, I had been putting up with their running things in the VN church. More and more I could see human nature in their manner. Rules and regulations which weaken the spiritual health. Especially, the discrimination spirit (which never be of God), a nasty attitude similar to Isaiah 47:8 & 10. (I am, no one else besides me) and so on. As long as I tried keep up with them, my conscience bothered me. I could see that I was only wasting my precious time while I tried to keep good company with them. Doing so, I was only serving man's organisation, not of God at all.
As years go by, the more I meditate on Jesus's words the more I could see that only the narrow minded and dictatorate would claim kingdom of God for oneself and for no one else. Especially to declare that all those who don't belong to their group to go to hell. That sounds laughable to VN people. Those who claim that only their group would go to Heaven and all others who not belong to them would go to Hell, I am sure that there is something wrong in their mind, if we avoid to say that they are too much of extremistic. Thru the years Darrel has been sick and had to take medicaments on & on; yet he did not recognise the phisical weakness effecting his mind and spirit. One time I talked to him about how the bodily sickness could affect the mind and spirit, but he rejected it. So he did not get any benefit from those mistakes that he had made.
The reason Uncle Hoa decided to stop cooperating with the Overseers in VN was because he “had suggested something but they put it aside. How can I cooperate with them if they never mind with any suggestions of mine? For example I suggested “Don’t organize the Special Meeting at Hoi An, but Darrel still kept it. It costs a lot of money for Workers to be there, and there are no professing folks in Hoi An.”
Minh Thanh wrote: Uncle Hoa disagreed with the way Canadian Overseers spent the money for these activities. It was not suitable for our poor country. Uncle Hoa explained that the Workers, including visiting Workers, had to fly to DaNang, then hire a van to Hoi An, and stay at a Hotel. This wastes lots of time and money—for a very few Friends who live near there. Very often there are more Workers than Friends at the Special Meeting at Hoi An! Even though Workers have been there for years, no one has ever professed. Hoi An is an ancient city and most people worship their ancestors. It also the special place for tourists with beaches and many resorts. The Workers also gather at Hoi An for a Workers Meetings and have meals in luxury restaurants there.
According to what Uncle Lyle told me, Overseers and Workers around the world are praising Uncle Darrel’s work, for bringing a lot of young people to be workers. To me, that is just like giving money to the young Workers so they can enjoy luxury. If they were not accepted to become a Worker they would never have chance to enjoy such high living style as that. Of course, a lot of young folks want to be Workers.With a staff of abundant of workers, and they live with high level of living so they depend on the money of Overseers. If they live the simple life such as the staff of Uncle Fred, there is no problem. Xuân Hoàn said , “This is the Overseers way, not God’s Way.”
Minh Thanh wrote: Uncle Hoa had fit in under the new oversight for years and went to any place they pointed for him to go. Never had any mistakes under their rule, such as stepping into other fields. When the arrangement was still good in Viet Nam, he completely submitted to their rule. Uncle Hoa always wanted to be a help with God's work. But he saw that the wrong that was happening was not under the Spirit of God's leading, especially what Darrel said to his staff in the Workers Meeting. When he saw what was happening with Uncle Châu, thenUncle Hoa knew for sure that it would be his turn next and they would do the same to him. From that Meeting, Uncle Hoa determined to stop cooperating with Darrel. So he stood up to get rid of the noose from his neck so he could freely labour as he should.
Uncle Hoa left feeling no shame and stopped cooperating with the Canadian Workers. I asked Uncle Hoa if I might post his Heart Letter on the TMB Message Board and also send it to Cherie as she requested. He agreed and said, ‘Say hello to Cherie and thanks for her hard work.’ He said to tell Cherie that he had read her website five years ago, and that her writing helped him to decide to leave for seeing things happening in VN just the same as many things she had written.
Uncle Hoa wrote: Sometime before 2010, Darrel Turner wanted to inform something to his staff. He posted the information to a website where each worker had a password to access that website. One time I tried to enter that website by googling the word ‘workers’ and I accidently discovered a lot of other websites regarding 2x2 church. Some websites gave many good points of 2x2 and others revealed new things to me, but I wasn't shaken at that time. I thought, ‘Sometimes the prince inherits the throne but he can be naughty.’ So the church can be corrupt but the worship depends on the spirit and heart. Eventually I found the website Telling The Truth. So I knew about the TTT website, thanks to Darrel Turner.
On August 26, 2010 Uncle Hoa wrote his “Heart Letter to every dear brother and sister.” He wrote the Friends that he cherished their friendship and fellowship and wanted to let them know about his decision and his future plans and intentions. Uncle Hoa asked us to send his “Heart Letter” to everybody after he left as he would not be in contact with anyone for a brief period of time. Uncle Hoa wrote: My heart-letter was sent by Xuân Hoàn and Minh Thanh as they have wifi in their house so they help sending to those in DT's staff, as well as friends they could reach. Some months later, Châu asked me to write to other Overseers who were involved in pushing Châu off from the work.
Uncle Hoa saw Darrel continue to blame Uncle Châu in the Workers Meeting after Special Meeting time. Uncle Hoa resigned to avoid being put out of the work as Châu had been. He removed himself from the Overseer’s control and system since he couldn’t in good conscience cooperate with their methods. He continued to offer his life to encourage and strengthen their souls and to help others who are in need and he planned to do so to the end of his life. Uncle Hoa gave permission to print his “Heart Letter” with this Account. (View Heart Letter in Appendix).
Remembering the Sister Friend had the purpose of buying our house, God had poured comfort into my heart, that God knows all. He knows His servants’ needs and reserved a place for Uncle Hoa.I had explained to Uncle Hoa our discussion with Mrs. Mai (the lady who wanted to buy our house) just one month before. Already the house was offered for God’s work and for the Workers to live in. We were very pleased when Uncle Hoa agreed to stay in the offered house.
The Death of Joseph Story (Colin Brodie)
There was a Canadian Worker named Colin Brodie who witnessed many things happening. We did appreciate him, he was a godly Worker, we learnt a lot from him, and he gave us many good advice too. After many things happened, he returned to Canada. I asked Uncle Hoa the reason why? Uncle Hoa replied, "Darrel said Colin is a bull-headed person." At that time, Uncle Hoa accompanied Darrel and Cường. After that, Darrel and Morris returned to Canada.
When Colin returned to VN, we welcomed him at the airport. His first saying with us was, "I didn't think that I would have the chance to come back to VN. I'm very happy to be here again." He accompanied Uncle Lyle to our house sometimes to hear and solve some problems. This time he didn't say a word... just listened and wrote down (I didn't know what for?) He preached that day.
I was taking my daughter in law to Gospel Meeting at my younger sister’s house. After Uncle Lyle spoke, it was Colin’s turn. His message was about Jesus’ life. That Jesus is the key to open the door for us; through His life we can enter the Kingdom of God. If we want to make one more key, we have to do every detail exactly, or we cannot open the door. Today, we are His Workers, and we have to follow exactly like Jesus' life in order to help others enter the Kingdom of God. He read Mark 3:33: "A crowd was sitting around him, and they told him, ‘ Your mother and brothers are outside looking for you.’Do you know the reason why His mother and brothers were looking for him? It must have been a very important and serious reason, such as Joseph died. Although His mother and brothers came and informed Jesus the sad news of Joseph passing away, Jesus still continued in His preaching, not returning home. Lyle S. here was the same as Jesus. Although his mother passed away some months ago, he was still here continuing with his preaching and had not returned home.
The day after was Monday, we were very surprised with a visit from an Elder named Thinh who for a long time didn't want to come into our house, because Darrel told him many made up stories about us. (We had a very nice relationship before.) This man has two younger sisters and one cousin in the work, and a Fellowship Meeting in his home too. We didn't know the reason why he came. He had been though some very sad and serious problems and remembered us. He came and told us about the hard experience he was facing with these Workers! He asked my husband to record all his telling and showing as evidence in case he passes away. My husband still keeps it.
Through his talking we also learned that Cường his cousin (Vietnamese Brother Worker) was back to the North a few days ago to attend his (Cường) grandmother's funeral! Immediately God showed us that the message given by Colin was wrong. Cường couldn't have gone back to the North without the Workers’ permission (while he was staying with them). With us, it doesn't matter that Cường returned to his grandmother's funeral. What bothers us is: Why did they know this, yet they still preached ‘Today, we are exactly like Jesus, not returning home even though Joseph had passed away?’
NOTE: There are no details recorded in the Vietnamese Bible or KJV Bible about Joseph’s death. Also there is no reason given in the Bible as to why Jesus’ mother and brothers were looking for him (Mark 3:33).
"The Past Belongs to the Devil"
A young Worker repeated the same thing she heard her companion say, something that was not in the Bible. My husband asked her, "Please show me where the Bible says, ‘ The past belongs to the devil?’ as you preached. We have read through the Bible many times, but never saw anything written there that said, ‘The past belongs to the devil.’ ”
Her reply was: "I heard it from a Worker, not the Bible." Workers (special Workers recruited by Darrel often mention something in their speech to portray Uncle Hoa was false or acted wrong, belongs to devil, or something negative like that. We were tired of hearing it and we didn't receive any help from the way they preached. Most all of them are young, and this young Worker was just saying the same as her companion had said in the past.
Immediately the two sister workers reported our conversation to Lyle. Uncle Lyle came to our house and said, "Because you do not support the young Worker, you shall never have the Fellowship gathering at your home again." We never want to support people that say things not written in the Bible.
Before the Canadian Overseers arrived, we were taught by Brothers Châu and Hoa that the first thing we needed to do when getting up every morning was to pray, meditate. After that, according to individual family, all the family members gathered together at appropriate time (early morning is the best) and studied the Bible. But now, Brother Darrel says “No studying together. Study individually.”
One day Miss E.M and Miss Hải, two sister workers, arranged to have a meal and pass a night at my parents’ house. They all had a very good time together. Before going to sleep, my father said to them, “Tomorrow my family will have Bible study at 5:30 AM. If possible, you may come to study with us.”
Early the next morning, both of them went down to the living room for Bible study with my parents, my oldest sister and her husband. There were 6 members sitting around the table. They had a wonderful time sharing spiritual bread together. After breakfast, they returned to their bach.
However a few hours later, both of them returned to my parents’ house again, explaining and saying, “We’re sorry for having the Bible study with you this morning…we shouldn’t have done that because we should have had private study.” So sorry, sorry, etc.… all the time!!!
Remembering the new changes from Darrel about families studying the Bible in the morning, my father said: “You didn’t do anything wrong with us. Since yesterday, we all have had a wonderful time together. We only had a meal, slept, ate, studied Bible, slept, ate. So there is no cause for you to say you’re sorry to me. Maybe Darrel is the one you should say you’re sorry to, because he prevented the Friends and Workers from studying Bible within family in the morning.”
At first Miss E.M & Hải did the right thing by studying the Bible with my parents, my sister and her husband. But when they returned their bach, they were somehow reminded of Darrel’s rule. Maybe they were instructed to return to my parents’ house and say they were wrong to study the Bible with them that morning. I feel it is really like a Tragi-comedy they had performed !!!
Thịnh came to our house saying that his sister Hải and his cousin Cường (both workers) were very afraid of Darrel T. Not only them, but almost all of the Workers were very afraid of Darrel, who was their Overseer. They were fearful that if they didn’t obey his rule or demands that they might be kicked out of the work.
Uncle Châu’s heart letter, written from Australia in August 2013, gave the same advice. "Friends should obey every demand of the Workers, even things that seem not right." The Overseer’s staff are the first people who prove that the Overseer’s demand is right--even when it does not seem right.
After they chased out Uncle Chau, the Fellowship Meeting at my house became terrible. Some disagreed with Darrel’s decision and others supported Darrel. Then the Fellowship became a place to stone one another. I sent an email to Uncle Dale telling of this situation!!!
LINK to Darrel’s rule from the Elder’s letter: www.tellingthetruth.info/history_divisions/vietnam.php
Elders’ List of Questions
Several Elders gathered together and prepared a letter that contained a list of their questions, observations and supplications. The Elders’ letter began like this:
We, God’s children belonging to churches scattered in the country of Vietnam, unanimously have the same voice to God’s Workers about God’s Work in Vietnam. First of all we want to show our gratitude to God’s Workers for spending their life to labour for God, especially those who have left their prosperous countries to come to Vietnam. Recent years, we have seen and heard some things from Brother Darrel (Overseer) and other Workers. We would mention them below. We wish our Workers to answer us in order that we can understand clearly, we are very grateful.
Part 1 The Things we want to ask
Part II The things we have seen
Part III Supplication
(View 3-page List in Appendix)
Working on a New Vietnamese Hymnbook
One of the above questions asked about the printing of a new hymnbook which has been in the works for several years. The following sheds some light into their interest. Minh Thanh tells how, when, where the new VN hymnbook project was started and how it was left.
Right after we had moved to Saigon, Ms Ân came to our house asking my husband how to write music on the computer. (Ân is one of my relatives on my mother's side, and at that time she was starting in the work and she exerted herself to the utmost to catch the Overseer's sight. Now she is a big help for Overseers in Vietnam.)
My husband worked on computers, but most all his work was in network. That was the subject he taught for students. Anyway, we heard from Ms Ân that Darrel had asked her to manage the project "Rewriting all the hymns on the computer.”
We used to have two printed hymnbooks before Liberation Day. The first book has 138 hymns. The second book has 100 hymns, most of them written by hand. We used these books together until the time we changed and numbered the hymns in the same order as the English hymnbook.
Hearing about this big project from Ms Ân, my husband was excited to cooperate with her, and to find a program suitable for that project. After considering carefully, he chose the Sibilius program. He wasn't a musician so he didn't know much about music. I had learned a little about music from Uncle Châu. Then my husband asked me to read and learn how to use the Sibilus program.
I used to be an accountant. Because of moving to Saigon, I had to stop my work, and my friends introduced me to a new job in Saigon. My husband said, "I can manage our life with my teaching. This project is more important than you going to work."
From the beginning, it was a big headache for me to learn the Sibilius program. I really didn't know the least bit about it. He persuaded me to learn day or night, even when I was waiting at the hospital for treatment! Learn...learn...learn...under the pressure of my husband, and then to practise on computer. After many times of failing, at last I could work with it.
It is a long story and many things happened along the way that I just couldn't understand!!! But now I understand all very clearly. Many times I wanted to give up, because of failing and rewriting. But my father and my husband encouraged me by saying: "God wanted you to move to Saigon for this work."So I tried through a couple of years until we could work through with Sibilius music program. We started working with Sibilius1, and after many failures, my husband found many faults in this program. He managed to help me in many others method to fulfill my work.
I love playing the organ, but play very little, just enough for playing hymns. That's all of my purpose, for whenever I feel sad or disappointed, I can play to encourage myself. When I was young, I loved to go to the party for singing and dancing, and all the activities of the young people in the big city. My classmates opened a party any time we had free time. Seeing this influence from life, Uncle Châu recommended I study to play hymns with the organ. Even now, whenever hearing music, immediately my body moves with the rhythm of the music. Anyway, many thanks for Uncle Châu having taught me, not much but enough for me to enjoy myself and work with the Sibilius music program.
I went through many feelings, tiredness, sadness, disheartened. At the time I learned the program, my husband asked Ms Ân and about ten more young Friends who could work with the computer to gather at our house for us to explain how to work with the program. Now it would be very easy to teach the Friends because I had gone through it and if they got stuck, they could just call me. Thinking this was the work of God, we had to be pioneers in the hard study, and now was the time for sharing our experience, and sharing the work with Friends too, in order that the Hymn Rewriting would soon be finished. My husband divided the number of hymns into many parts. I took a half of the amount, and the rest were given to the Friends. We were all happy with the work now and all cooperating together.
Did you know what happened next?No one sent back to me any hymns--not even Ms Ân, the new worker who had received this project from Darrel. No one asked or called for help...all kept silent... A scary silence. For me, from that time I knew I had to work alone with the project!!! It was up to me. This sad picture made me feel so tired!!!
I had not mentioned anything to Uncle Châu about this music program from the beginning, because that was the time he traveled for visiting some countries. I had announced for him how we started to learn and to rewrite hymns by computer. (At that time I still thought Uncle Châu still had the responsibility for all things in VN). Uncle Châu wanted to translate more English hymns into Vietnamese. He encouraged Friends to translate all the rest hymns which we still did not have in Vietnamese hymn book.
Responding to him, there were very few hymns were translated. So he had to do it all by himself. When returning to VN, Uncle Châu used all his time for translating as much as possible. Not easy to translate a hymn into Vietnamese, because our language has many accents. So it took much time for him.
Then it came time to put the music and lyrics together. Of course, it was not easy to fit the lyrics as we wanted, because no hymn is just like the other; some too long, or too many words. Uncle Châu often let me know the number of the hymn, for I recorded the notes of the music first, then he gave me the lyrics to put in.
One time he had worked until midnight, but he couldn’t finish the hymn 270. There was one last lyrics still left. He said, “You may translate the 4th lyric in this hymn, I want to take a rest.” It took a few hours for me to translate only one lyric, and luckily Uncle Châu accepted my translation. That has been my biggest work for translation of hymns till now, the 4th lyrics in hymn 270.
I thought it took about three years, but he couldn’t translate all, even though Uncle Châu had many experiences in translating hymns. He used to be an English teacher and a musician too. For this was the temporary hymn book, so we had to stop for printing.
There were many hymns in our Vietnamese hymn book had been put out which we used very often. We didn’t want to abandon them, so we gathered all of them and put them at the end of the new hymn book.
It was very complicated to put hymns in order to print. All my family had worked with it day and night, including my Father. We had to arrange them according to the new order, as in English hymn book (the order of the old VN hymn book was different from the one in English hymn book).
Then when everything was fit, no printing company would agree to print it for us, because we didn’t have a license from the Religion Committee of the VN government!!! So we had them photocopied and assembled into books. Thịnh (brother of two sister workers) enthusiastically participated this work for us.
The VN Friends and Workers were taught that all the hymns were written by Workers and Friends. One time, Mr. Vũ Trung Hiền (Uncle Châu’s brother) reminded me that there were many Protestant hymns that were stolen by 2x2s, such as Hymn No. 1, Tell me the Story of Jesus. From the teaching of 2x2 Workers, many Friends here in VN also believe this is God’s only true way, that the way is from the beginning and that it is the only way in which people can enter the Kingdom of God.
2011 - Lyle Shultz becomes Overseer of Vietnam
The situation continued to get worse and worse. Dale Shultz sent his brother Lyle to take Darrel’s place and bring peace and unity. Darrel was no longer in charge once Uncle Lyle came, so we didn’t ask Darrel any more questions. In the past our workers had freedom to go anywhere under the Spirit of God leading, by the urge in their heart. Now they had to stay at the places Uncle Lyle appointed for them. Uncle Hoa told us he felt it was wasting his time for he was spending most of his time at the bach, waiting to preach two days in a week, Sunday and Wednesday). It is hard for the Vietnamese workers now trying to follow Jesus as written in the Bible.
Uncle Lyle asked uncle Châu to visit Friends in the field he appointed. When Uncle Châu went to visit another place with some Friends, Uncle Lyle got angry with him. They sent Uncle Châu to Cambodia, East Timor and Australia, while sending many foreign Workers to Vietnam.
Dale Shultz wrote in his summary letter: …the decision was made by the Overseers closer to your land that Jim Girton, Keith Olsen and Jiwhan Yu would visit your country to try to sort out the problem that was there and hopefully come up with a plan that would work towards a solution. It was during their visit to your land that my brother, Lyle, was approached concerning coming to your country to help. Since that time, Lyle, Lloyd Morgan, Jim Girton, Ernest Robinson, Keith Olsen (until he passed away) and Jiwhan Yu have included me in much of the communication concerning events and issues in your country.
MT: On Oct 27, 2011 at my parent’s house, we had a visit with Uncle Jim Girton (Philippine Overseer) who was leaving that night, as well as Uncle Châu (before he went to Cambodia), and Uncle Lyle (going back to India on Dec 15, 2011). Uncle Lyle promised us, “I will gather the Friends together and answer all the questions when I come back from India in January, 2012.” We were all happy with Uncle Lyle’s promise. My brother-in-law recorded his promise in his diary book.
Uncle Lyle returned Dec. 27, 2011. We waited and waited, but there never was a gathering or any answers. My older sister and her husband reminded Uncle Lyle that this matter was important to the Friends, and asked him to please don’t drop this matter. Instead Uncle Lyle asked his staff to go to their fields and give the answers to those who wanted. (It seemed that this way they could find out which Friends don’t agree with them.) My sister and her husband are still in their Fellowship and wish Uncle Lyle hadn’t broken his promise.
Mr. Bau wrote: At first Lyle Shultz was welcomed because he said he came to restore the unity and peace. However, day by day we didn’t see anything as he promised and his actions revealed that he wanted to conceal the wrong doings of Darrel and he only made the division more and more severe!! Sad to say, Lyle created even more problems! We had the feeling Lyle came here to defend his nation, and not for God’s Kingdom. We wanted him to come here to help not to rule!
Minh Thanh wrote: We talked with Uncle Lyle, opening everything for him to understand, because we did so hope he would take over all the matters, in order he could resolve the situation, and restore the unity. The Friends asked Uncle Lyle in a letter, thinking Uncle Lyle was in charge of resolving the problems.
We asked many times for a gathering as they have arranged at the time they declared Uncle Châu out, for this happening to clear all the misunderstanding according to the teaching of Jesus in Bible. To Darrel, to Overseers from others countries, and then to Lyle S… they all knew we wanted a gathering. We had been in contact with them many times, by many ways, through last three years. We even asked them to call Uncle Châu back, and to cooperate with him to solve the problem, because Uncle Châu knew his sheep far better than these Overseers. But they never wanted to do the simple way as Jesus has taught in the Bible. We emailed Uncle Lyle on March 2012: “We would like to beg you for the peace of the fold of God to cooperate together to carry the load of God’ work. It’s advisory that a Vietnamese Worker shares the leading with you since only a Vietnamese will understand more clearly Vietnamese people.”
Sadly, right after his return, at the convention in December 2012, Uncle Lyle admonished Uncle Châu in front of his staff for the content of an email Uncle Châu had sent to Thịnh, the brother of two sister workers. After that, some of the young Workers looked at him through strange eyes. Even though Uncle Châu was in the work at that time, some young Workers continued to find fault with him in an effort to push him out again.
Uncle Châu asked my husband, a former IT Instructor, how Uncle Lyle could have received a copy of his private email. My husband replied that Cường (a young Vietnamese Brother Worker) had learned IT and that he must have fraudulently configured his cousin's computer so that all emails sent from Uncle Châu would automatically be forwarded to his Inbox. Then these emails were kept in Uncle Lyle's black list.
Châu was on a Convention tour in Australia in 2013. When giving his testimony in Australia, he mentioned a couple of times the need to “obey them that have rule over you.” Suggested reading: Obey Them - Wicked Sheperds
Link to SE Asia Workers Photo
Lyle Shultz Pressures Miss Lan to Revise her Will
Miss Lan is the only lady whose name is included in the VN government registry documents for Christian Mission of Vietnam. When Fred Allen registered the church in 1967 ("Sứ Mạng các Thánh Đồ") he gave his name as the responsible leader. The four Friends listed on the Managing Committee were: Miss Lan, Nguyễn Huu Bau, Nguyễn Thanh Hoa, and Đào Hữu Phỉ (deceased).
Even though Miss Lan is going on 90 and is very weak with sickness in her body, her spirit is still very strong. She loves the Workers and Friends both far and near, regardless of which side they are on. She not only thinks about, but also helps Workers and Friends in their need. We all love her. When she stayed in the hospital, Friends on both side visited her.
More than a year ago, Miss Lan asked my father to transfer her Will to Uncle Hoa. She said that if she passed away, she would like for Uncle Hoa to return back to Saigon and lead her funeral service. She would pay for the airplane ticket if he was in a faraway place. Receiving her letter, Uncle Hoa replied immediately to her that he would come back for her funeral right away wherever he was--no need to pay for an airplane ticket.
Somehow Uncle Lyle found out about the Will arrangements that Miss Lan sent to Uncle Hoa. He and some Workers on his staff, along with the Doctor Trung came to her house and explained many things to help her understand why she should change her mind and her Will too. The main reason, according to Uncle Lyle was because Uncle Hoa didn’t have any part in the work in VN anymore, so how could he celebrate her funeral service? The Will should be changed so that Lyle S. and his staff would celebrate her funeral service.
After this conversation, Miss Lan rewrote her Will to say that the VN Overseer, Workers, Doctor T, and Mr. Bau will work together to organise her funeral service. She provided that Friends far and near would be invited to come on her last day. There was a note at the bottom “This will replaces the former Will.”
Although she did not mentioned Uncle Hoa in her new Will, the Workers didn’t agree with her new Will either. The reason? Her new Will still had Mr. Nguyễn Huu Bau’s name in it! They asked her one more time to change her Will and remove Mr. Bau’s name. They even sent her another Will they made without my father’s name! Her answer was: “I cannot change what I have written. Mr. and Mrs. Bau have been my very close and loving Friends for more than 50 years.” At this time, the Will in effect for Miss Lan’s funeral service is the second one that includes Mr. Bau’s name.
Because she is the only one in her family who professed, she was afraid of what her family might do after she passed. They belong to Buddhism. Recently she gave a lot of money to various Friends. I had a part too, although I’m not poor. Maybe that is the way she wants to send her love to Friends she has loved for many years before she passes away. She told me that God had given her enough and now that she had become old, she didn't need much money any more, so she wanted to share with friends. What a lovely Auntie, I do so love her.
Lyle Interferes with Wedding Plans
We have an Elder as a Worker. His name is Anh Mãnh (Mãnh means very strong). We all respect him as if he was a Worker. He travels throughout the country with our Workers in the Golden Time till now, sometimes with Uncle Châu in the past, and now with Uncle Hoa here and there. He is always being with comfort while Friends experienced sorrows. He has a very strong mind and firm spirit, in a very tender heart. Given us many beautiful examples in serving God. I can't describe his godly manner by word. Calm in his serving, never has any loud voice from him. Every time we meet him, we have been studying from him how to serve and please God.
He has 6 children, they all professed. Although after Liberation Day, life was very difficult for him, he always did his best for the Way. Many Friends professed by seeing his faithfulness in words and deeds. We all love him, thanks for a very faithful Elder as a Worker life.
Time went by. One day there was the wedding of Mr. Mãnh's granddaughter with a professing Brother. They asked Lyle’s permission for Uncle Châu to come back to VN (He was in Cambodia) for their wedding ceremony. But Lyle refused. After some conversations, neither side could agree. At last the young couple chose Uncle Hoa. They didn't mind whether Uncle Lyle agreed or not. In return Uncle Lyle prevented all the Workers and Friends on their side from attending the wedding. A struggle happened…one more reason the Golden Friends at DiLinh refuse to welcome foreign Workers again.
Traditionally in Vietnam, a wedding is often organized over two or three days. The first day the bride’s relatives gather, not only for sharing happiness but also to give some advice or tell about experiences in life for the bride. The next day the groom’s family comes to ask and receive the bride as a new family member. Many friends and relatives accompany the bride to the groom’s house. The bride is presented before the ancestor altar and is introduced to each member of the groom’s family. The last day is the ceremony service at a restaurant for both sides and friends. Very often the last day is used for their wedding ceremony because it is the day printed in their wedding invitation.
2012 - Uncle Lyle and His Staff in an Astray Van
On the 18th of June 2012, my youngest brother passed away. He was divorced and remarried and did not continue in the way. Uncle Hoa had the funeral service. We were free to take photos and speak.
Three days after that an adopted son of a couple Friends passed away too. We just met him with his father at my brother’s funeral. With my father, we went to Song Ray (110Km far from Saigon) to comfort the loss with his parents. Uncle Lyle led the funeral service. He started by reminding: “No taking photos!” No Friends spoke, just Uncle Lyle and Worker at that field did.
We all went to the cemetery near there. Many Friends followed the coffin by walking or riding on motorbike. The country lane was too small and muddy--it was the rainy season. All the Workers got into the first van. (They rented this van from Saigon.) The second van was for the relatives of that family. My father and I were in the last van. These vans took a roundabout route to avoid muddy places.
Nearly reaching the cemetery, the first van (with all the Workers inside) instead of turning right into the way leading to the gate of the cemetery, that van went straight. Seeing the first car going the wrong way, we stopped and sounded the horn “pin..pin...pin.” It seemed the sounds didn’t reach the driver’s ears and he continued driving ahead, further and further. One of the Friends took the motorbike running after that van; many others phoned to some Workers inside that van. It was really difficult for the van to turn back, because the road was narrow with just enough room for a van, both side are the corn field. I don't know how they managed, but at long last they turned back, now following the leading of a motorbike to the cemetery. All the Friends had been standing there for waiting for the Workers for nearly one hour. The Workers did not want to be astray, but the driver did not know the way of that area, and instead of following the other van, he drove in advance. This trouble caused us return to Saigon late at night!
For me, that was a lively lesson from God for Uncle Lyle and his staff. We all waited for a solution... such as all the Friends had patience to wait for the astray van with Workers inside returning. The driver was a Canadian, just being in VN a little more than a year. How could he know everything about VN to lead the churches himself? As I mentioned to Lyle in my letter on the 3rd of March, it would be far better to call Uncle Châu back and to cooperate with him leading and solving the problems raised in many churches, than for them to drive Uncle Châu out and send him to Cambodia. But Uncle Lyle didn’t care.
Lyle Requests Meeting with Uncle Hoa
Lyle wrote in a letter: On February 15, 2012, Colin, Peter, Cuong and I had a visit with Uncle Hoa at our residence in Ho Chi Minh City. Over the last several months, Uncle Hoa has been moving quietly among our friends and at the same time avoiding any contact with teachers. During the special season, he avoided being at any center where classes were being held. Uncle Hoa saw no reason to meet with the Canadian Workers since he had decided he was no longer going to cooperate with them and was no longer under their control. Uncle Hoa had sent out his Heart Letter on Aug. 26, 2010, one and a half years earlier.
Lyle's letter continued: This has raised questions in the minds of several of our friends and they have been asking us about him. We felt that it was necessary for us to speak directly with Uncle Hoa so that we can give a suitable answer to those who enquire about his activities. During our visit together, we asked Uncle Hoa several times to tell us clearly what we should tell our friends regarding his relationship with us. He finally told us that he is not in agreement with the way that we are working here. We made no headway in our attempt to visit with him further on that subject and eventually he terminated our discussion abruptly and left.
Uncle Hoa wrote: I wrote to Lyle and others about legalising the church with overseas preachers within and a hopeful way of how to go on with our VN government's policy. But Lyle said 'to register to this government is not wise'. So I told him in a rendezvous that I disagree with them so I don't support and don't cooperate with them anymore.
Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well. For so is the will of God. ( Peter 2:13-15)
Minh Thanh wrote: The only relationship of Uncle Hoa with these people was “Together working for the work of God in Viet Nam.” Now the Canadians came, destroyed and changed all that our native workers had built through decades. How could he agree with the way they are working? Now Uncle Hoa continues to labor as before moving from cities to towns and countrysides to help our Friends in their Faith. We all stand behind him and we do believe that ‘The Father knoweth what things ye have need of.’ God will take care of him. Uncle Hoa has never joined with us in anything we did in either single works or group works, or posting on the internet, but we always let him know what we are doing. Uncles Châu and Hoa both love all the folks, but they show their love quite differently. Easy to understand with Uncle Hoa’s work; however Uncle Châu’s actions have caused many misundertandings on both sides!
Lyle started his letter with “Over the last several months, Uncle Hoa has been moving quietly among our friends and at the same time avoiding any contact with teachers.” Uncle Hoa has his own right to go anywhere in our country because he is a Vietnamese. He also has his right to visit friends, because they are his flock. Uncles Châu and Hoa spiritually bore and raised almost all of us. They had the responsibility to look after the Vietnamese flock through the decades, and did so with all their love and unity for the souls of the Friends throughout the country--until the Canadian workers came. That is why uncle Châu said “All the fields are mine. I feel free to visit friends.” The same goes for Uncle Hoa because they both have responsibility for the work of God in Viet Nam. I consider the Canadians hijacked the sheep in our country!!!
In spite of long distances, through mountains, valley, forests, rivers Uncle Hoa overcomes and rides on a simple motorbike to get to them. Impelled by love, he seeks the lost sheep. In the time he’s been preaching on his own, several have professed.
An elderly couple at Long Thành reaction to Lyle's Letter about Hoa: Could you please tell my expression to Mr Lyle. This is one Mr. Lyle but even ten Mr. Lyles writing like this, we still not accept. Because uncle Hoa and uncle Châu they both my real shepherds. They have raised us, fed us, and even corrected us when ever we are doing wrong, they have sacrificed their life for our souls and the work of God in this country.
2012 - Lyle’s Letter & Ultimatum: “Obey me or I will not take care of you anymore.”
For awhile after Uncle Hoa left the Work and Fellowship, all our family stayed in the Fellowship with Friends. We live near my older sister and she lives next door to my parents. When my sister repaired her house where we and my parents took part, the Fellowship Meetings were temporarily stopped there, and Uncle Lyle scattered the Friends to other houses for the Fellowship Meeting. Particularly, my daughter and my husband couldn't travel that far so I asked Uncle Lyle to temporarily move the Fellowship Meeting to our house, but he refused. So we started to have Fellowship within our family. When the repairs were done, Lyle didn’t open the Fellowship Meeting in my sister’s house again as in the past. We knew they wanted to get rid of us for a long time, and the repair of the house gave Uncle Lyle a good excuse to make it hard for us to get to Meetings.There had been four in our family who had Meetings in our homes--now there is just only my youngest sister who still has a Fellowship Meeting in her home, because her family is a great help to them.
Soon after Lyle had his talk with Uncle Hoa, he wrote a letter and gave it to the Workers to read in their fields. The Workers only read this letter and didn’t send it to anyone. Many friends asked to have a copy and were refused. We have a copy the same way we had a copy of Uncle Fred’s letter to the Overseers. God gave it to us, because HE is displeased with the spirit written in that letter. A Friend borrowed the letter from a foreign Worker in his field who asked him not copy the letter. He was afraid that we didn’t know there was a letter written about Uncle Hoa, so he brought it to our place for us to read. We have a photocopy machine at home, and my husband immediately copied the letter before reading it. The Friend didn’t copy it—my husband did. Then the Friend returned the letter the day after. There are many friends still in their Fellowship who disagree with Lyle’s letter!
So we had already read the whole letter before hearing it from the Workers in our field. The two main things that we did not agree with in his letter were that the Workers “deserve our highest respect” (it is our Lord’s place in our heart, not Workers). And that Uncle Hoa “is not considered a part of the teacher staff in this country now.” (View Letter in Appendix)
Those were the reasons why my father was so angry when Uncle Lyle and Cường came to my father’s house to read his letter. My father said to Lyle, “ That’s what YOU say; God never says like that.” Seeing my father disagreed with his letter, Lyle told him: “ I can’t take care of you any more.” My father replied, “ God will take care of us.”
A few days later Colin and Uncle Lyle came to our house to talk with us, but we refused to listen. I said “I know what’s in the letter—there’s no need to read it to us.” Uncle Lyle said: “If you refuse to obey me, I will not take care of you anymore.”
The Golden Friends begin their own Fellowship Meetings - We can't walk in double lines.
We began to be afraid. If a lie could not enter the Kingdom of God, how can the Workers who have lied to us lead us? So far, the Workers have not admitted their mistakes, and they haven’t corrected the problems. They’ve only made them worse.Until now, no one has seen or heard any apology of Darrel to Uncle Châu and we do not anticipate one.We see the same spirit in Overseers Darrel Turner, Lyle Shultz and Dale Shultz. We haven't seen the love, the truth, or the righteousness in their work. Luke 6:44 For each tree is known by its own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.
While Darrel was causing trouble to my family and he was not leading us as the Bible taught or with leading us with the Spirit of God, my family decided to leave them. We stopped attending Meetings with Lyle's organisation and started the Fellowship Meetings with Golden Friends in my father's house. We were free from Lyle's power. After doing everything we could without any results, we told Lyle, "We can't walk in double lines” (we can't make any progress). As David in Psalms 6:6 “I am weary with my groaning; every night make I my bed to swim; I water my couch with my tears.”
We worried if we were making the right choice or not? Seeing our doubt and worry, Uncle Hoa said to my husband. "Search in Google for 2x2, you can see clearly what they are." He had read TTT about five years ago. When my husband had read "the transfer oversight letter of Uncle Fred Allen,” he saw at the bottom of the letter a list of names which Uncle Fred forwarded the copies to. My husband noticed the names: Eldon Tenniswood, Willis Propp, Paul Sharp. He googled Eldon Tenniswood and found out many things about this Overseer. And then he searched "Willis Propp" and we had comfort when we find out the things that happened in Alberta Canada, the excommunications, which were nearly the same as what has happened in VN. We then contacted Edgar Massey and he referred us to the website Telling The Truth. We are thankful for all who have written there, and now we are even more convinced that we made the right choice and are full of happiness for what God has revealed to us.
Sometimes Uncle Hoa gives a very little idea of his thoughts, like ‘I value what Cherie does on TTT. It’s been a help to me.’ He had accessed this website five years before. When he saw these Overseers display the same as some on the website, it gave him more motivation to escape their yoke and to continue to serve God freely.
From that time I felt my need stronger. I read the Bible more and more and prayed more too. It was wonderful that through the Bible God showed me clearly how to serve him. As I learned and did as Jesus taught, I gained joy and was happy with the leading of Spirit of God. His yoke really is easy and his burden really is light. "Come take my yoke upon you. My yoke is easy and my burden is light." (Matthew 11:30)
Uncle Hoa Continues…Alone with God
In the past they spread many unbelievably bad stories about Uncle Châu, and then they did the same to Uncle Hoa! It doesn’t matter what they are doing or saying. Uncle Hoa is now acting like Paul in Galatians 2: 4-6: ‘and that because of the false brethren privily brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, that they might bring us into bondage: to whom we gave place in the way of subjection, no, not for an hour; that the truth of the Gospel might continue with you. But from those who were reputed to be somewhat (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth not man's person)--they, I say, who were of repute imparted nothing to me.’
Listening to the cry of sheep, Uncle Hoa left his place to help and feed them. You can't know how very many needy souls in VN now are waiting for Uncle Hoa to visit and tell them the message of salvation for them. There are many very thirsty souls in the far regions who want to know the message from above for their salvation. So he doesn't mind what others say about him. He just continues in his devotion to bring God’s love to anyone in need. The rest of the Golden Elders closely cooperate with him to keep the precious things we have had and to share them with others.
Uncle Hoa makes his plans to go here and there wherever God reveals to him. When there is a needy soul, he is willing to change his plans and go there immediately. Such as one very old Friend, about 90 years old (the landlord of Vườn Dừa Bến Tre) where we have gathered many times. He is very sick now, and wants to meet Uncle Hoa. Another man wants to meet Uncle Hoa, because he is now very seriously ill, and perhaps he wants to profess again. And especially one lady in Suối lạnh, about 150Km far from Saigon, a little hard to reach there, through the rubber tree forest and some springs. Having experienced our sweet gatherings and sometimes attended our Meetings, she phoned Uncle Hoa to come for her professing. Very often through our Friends’ lives or telling the Truth to friends or neighbors, the people want to know God’s salvation, and we contact the Workers to come help them.
We know that many western Workers are willing to come to VN to visit like Uncle Hoa does, but due to government restrictions, it’s really hard for them and our Friends also. One time seeing the Canadian Workers visit a very poor lady with two children, immediately the authority in that region cut off the welfare for the poor to that family, making their life become even more difficult. That is why we need Uncle Châu back in VN, because it is appropriate for a native to go anywhere as before (not stay in a place and under strange rules).
Xuân Hoàn wrote: I had been lucky because I had met a staff of workers whose only concern was to sow a seed of Christ in my heart until Christ became greater in my heart and they became smaller. Same as John Baptist said: "He must increase, but I must decrease" John 3:30. They helped me day by day more and more depend on the Bible and less and less depend on them. Uncle Fred's staff comprised of Auntie Bonnie Dahlin, Auntie Phyllis Munn, Uncle Edwin, Uncle Cecil, Uncle Christie, Uncle Châu, Uncle Hoa, Sister Thư Anh, Sister Băng Ngọc. I am very very grateful to them. I didn't have a lot of time with them due to the Liberation Day came very soon to me. But I continued being fed by Uncle Hoa, Uncle Châu, Sister Thư Anh and Sister Băng Ngọc. In my opinion, maybe not true, Uncle Fred's staff was a particular staff, rarely encountered now days. Now the Workers (in my country) demand the Friends ‘because the teacher staff is a precious, dedicated group of men and women who deserve our highest respect.’ I feel he wanted the Workers to increase, and Christ to decrease. (View letter in Appendix).
Minh Thanh wrote: Uncle Hoa often connects with us in another way. He always takes with him a tablet with 3G (able to access internet), in order he can skype with us or with some friends in USA although he is in the remote village without internet. By this way, sometimes we have Bible study with Uncle Hoa through internet, with friends at his visiting place, and friends in States as well. We do value the time we meet together through skype on internet where we can meet face by face, hear and follow our friends reading Bible. Thanks for Uncle Hoa working, not only brings us close to God by studying the Bible, but also bring us close together with others, with full of happiness in Christ. I never see any other workers in my country work like Uncle Hoa, although they have more expensive laptops or tablets than Uncle Hoa. I want to share with Workers around the world, as for me this is the very good way to take care of and feed the flock.
Summary of Dale Shultz’ Letter of Explanation
In a letter dated April 28, 2012, Dale Shultz outlined his involvement in the Vietnam problems during the two weeks he spent there attempting to resolve the problems others had written him about. For the first week, Tsutomu Miyata (Overseer of Japan) and Simeon Sarmiento (Philippines/Indonesia) were there also. First they visited the Workers about Châu and then they discussed with Châu the problem areas. Châu agreed to make some changes. “Because Châu was still in the midst of getting the family property transferred to new owners and disposing of the proceeds thereof, we suggested that he take a leave of absence from being active in the ministry until these business affairs were all finalized.”
Châu’s “business affairs” were a problem simply because Dale and Darrel erroneously believed that Chau was the owner of a house, when the owner was actually Châu’s brother Mr. Vu Hiền. Proceeds from a sale belonged to Hiền and were not Châu’s to dispose of. Nevertheless, to please the Workers and so he could remain in the work, with his brother’s permission, Châu found someone willing to purchase his brother’s house. The buyers were Xuân Hoàn and Minh Thanh.
Dale Shultz wrote that he expected the relationship to improve between Châu and the Workers during the 19 months Châu was out of the work, but that it didn’t improve enough to allow Châu to return to the work in VN. Dale attempted to have Châu preach in California, but the American Immigration denied his application. Instead Châu was reinstated as a Worker and sent to Cambodia, even though he is badly needed in VN. Dale also asked his brother, Lyle, to go to Vietnam to help resolve matters. Dale closed his letter with:
Much remains to be done in order that the divisions that have developed in your country can be resolved . Much also needs to take place in order for most of the Teaching Staff and many of the Students in your country to have confidence in Châu again. We are as anxious to see that happen as you are and we will continue to work patiently with the staff, Students and Châu to that end. However, this effort requires your full cooperation. We appeal to all of you to work closely and cooperatively with Lyle and Lloyd. This is the order that our great teacher honors and blesses and is the only hope of unity and joy being restored in fullest measure. (read full copy in Appendix)
The bolded phrases above are much like those in a Letter Dale Shultz wrote dated April 12, 1999 to pacify upset Friends in Alberta. At the time he wrote this letter, he was Overseer of Saskatchewan, Canada.
I would just like to encourage you to…respect that decision because it comes from a group of men whom God has called and whom God is using in guiding his work in this part of the earth. If our attitude towards them becomes disrespectful, it is a reflection on our attitude towards God as well.
We realize that the fact that we are servants of God, or even very responsible servants of God, doesn't make us infallible. However, something that is very much a part of being a child of God is to respect those who are over us in the Lord, to pray for them, to obey them, to esteem them very highly in love for their work's sake. Their judgement may not always be right, but it is always right for us to respect that judgement and to work with it in the best way that we possibly can.
[whether right or wrong]…it does remain the right thing to respect that decision because of where it has come from and to work with it no matter what our own thoughts might be on the subject…We may think that we are "obeying men" and not "obeying Christ" when we submit to something that seems wrong to our own thinking. However, the scriptures…teaching doesn't just apply when the governments, husbands, parents or Workers are 100% on the right track, but it applies in a very comprehensive way…Whether the decision is right or wrong, the right thing for all of us is to respect it because of those who have made the judgement. (View Letter on TTT)
Uncle Lyle Nixes Hoàn & Minh Thanh’s Plans to Visit Uncles Edwin and Châu in Australia
We had a disappointing experience when my husband and I went to Australia in September, 2013 to celebrate the 100th year anniversary of the foundation of my GIA LONG High School, with the gathering of teachers and friends from all over the world. It is not easy for Vietnamese people to get a visa to enter Australia.
We were very happy to go there, because it also gave us the opportunity to visit our dearly loved Uncle Edwin [Allen], and some of our Friends we had communicated with for decades. Before we left, we contacted Uncle Châu and his sister (also my teacher) in the USA and arranged a time we would meet in Brisbane, Queensland, Australia. A married Friend couple there welcomed us to their home, and we informed them the time we would arrive.
Uncle Lyle S. had asked my sister about the trip we planned to Australia…and from what happened later, it appeared he had also warned Châu not to see us. To our great disappointment, at the very last we had to cancel that part of our trip and we lost a lot of money since we had non-refundable airplane tickets.
Since we couldn't go to Queensland, we emailed Uncle Châu that we wanted to buy an airplane ticket for him to come to Sydney (invite him to our gathering); or we would go visit him at Adelaide where he was staying. But hewas too afraid to meet us and refused with the reason, "I'll get in trouble if I meet you." I asked him to give me the telephone number or email address of the Overseer there, for me to contact, but he would not.
Our Vietnamese Friends and Uncle Châu’s brother were surprised that we couldn't meet Uncle Châu while we were in Australia, knowing how close we had been with himand they questioned us as to the reason. Sadly, it will probably be the same if he comes back to VN under the authority of the VN Overseer. He will not be able to contact the Golden Friends then either. It’s not likely that we will have the opportunity to go to Australia another time to meet with Uncle Edwin. He is very old now!
2014 March -Uncle Chau Goes to Visit Family in America
On March 26, 2014, my daughter and I went to the airport to see Uncle Châu off to the United States. He will be visiting his family for three months after 47 years of continuous labor. During these three months Uncle Châu won’t preach and will only attend the Fellowship Meetings. After Duyên Thơ, his niece, let his family know the whole truth about what was happening to him throughout the past four years, all his brothers and sisters became angry and wanted him to return to them and live the rest of his life in the affectional arms of the family members. His eldest brother (Uncle Vũ Đức Nghiêm is a well-known musician in VN), who has done his best to enable Uncle Châu to go to the States. And he completed this longing in a short moment.
Because he feared the Overseers, he was afraid to contact us and tried to shun us to please them. But we know for sure that he still love us in his heart. Recently, he returned to our house to get his papers and clothes for his journey. During our conversation, I noticed his eyes being very dim (nearly blind), and his ears being hard of hearing. According to what uncle Chau has told me, his eyes will become worse and worse by the time. He went to eye hospital many times in VN and Singapore, they all said, "They cannot heal."
We also desire after three months staying with his family, that he will continue to stay with his family there in accordance with the desire of his brothers and sisters. Otherwise, if he returns to Vietnam, he can ask to retire to stay with us or with any other Friends, to use the rest of his life for visiting and feeding God’s people. I find that is more useful than being tied to the rules of 2x2 system.
The day before Uncle Chau left for the States, I received an email from Uncle Graham Thompson from New Zealand. We have the same ideas in the letter for the present time, and I forward that letter to uncle Châu to see. That is our desire. We do not know his choice. Although we always pray for him to choose the way which pleases God, and does not take part or cover up the wrong things, the same as many ex-workers have chosen.
Uncle Châu has 10 brothers and sisters. The oldest brother passed away two years ago. One of his brothers lives in France, and Uncle Châu was the only one who remained in VN. All the other seven family members are living in USA. His youngest sister and youngest brother (Mr. Hiền) will meet him at the airport. Uncle Châu said that he will be meeting about 100 members in his parents’ family. So this is a very important gathering of his family, because they are all getting old.
Uncle Châu has 10 brothers and sisters. The oldest brother passed away two years ago. One of his brothers lives in France, and Uncle Châu was the only one who remained in VN. All the other seven family members are living in USA. His youngest sister and youngest brother (Mr. Hiền) will meet him at the airport. Uncle Châu said that he will be meeting about 100 members in his parents’ family. So this is a very important gathering of his family, because they are all getting old.
Xuan Hoan wrote: We have to say that thanks to Internet, thanks to TMB, now Dale Shultz, Lyle Schultz, and Darrel T. dare not belittle and treat badly Uncle Châu any more. We felt a different atmosphere when Uncle Châu returned to Vietnam. I hope they sincerely want to change their minds and attitude. In my opinion, one other thing they cannot change: "Day by day people know more of the truth about 2x2ism." This is the most important thing. We need to exalt the flag of our Lord, our faith in Jesus Christ, the way of worship which our Father pleases.
If the government allows Uncle Chau to remain in California where he can retire from the work due to his health, the workers will be able to save face over the way they have been treating Uncle Chau. Actually, this is the perfect solution for the Workers regarding Uncle Chau, and they are likely very pleased that Uncle Chau’s relatives want him to stay with them and have made these arrangements. It takes Uncle Chau off their hands, and out of the work--without them having to do the dirty work. Workers retiring with family who want them is usually considered a good solution for any worker whose health is failing. It happens frequently. When there is no family able to care for them, the retired workers often go to the rest homes Friends operate in America. Uncle Chau’s case brings to mind Wm. Irvine after he was put out of the work and decided to move to Jerusalem. The workers were pleased with his decision which solved their problem and they no longer had to deal with him.
Uncle Châu phoned and invited my friend to go to the convention in USA. Her answer: "Whenever I see the Vietnamese workers respect you in Viet Nam. I will come back to the fellowship."
Workers Instruct their Friends to Shun the Golden Friends
In the past, some Elders and Friends join with us in the special gatherings. When they returned they were asked by the Workers or Elders to make their choice to be with them or with us. The answer is their action to associate with us to worship God.
Of Mr. Bau’s four living children, only his daughter Minh Thanh has chosen to be with the Golden Friends, along with her husband, son and daughter. Adding even more pain and hurt, the Workers have instructed their group to cut off or shun the Friends who separated from them—even close relatives! One day, my sister came into our house and said to me: "Workers asked me to separate with you!" My answer is; "Why I have to separate with my sister, while she doesn't do anything wrong to me?"
We saw that things were changing and were no longer like the Golden Time of Uncles Fred, Châu and Hoa. We were all in the Fellowship with Friends and Workers. Even after they chased out Uncle Châu, we remained in the Fellowship. While we were asking questions and waiting for the answers to understand all the changing and happenings and while disagreeing with the way the Overseers were changing things and were sad with the mess, we still kept on in the Fellowship. Even though Uncle Hoa stopped cooperating with the Overseers, my parents and we still continued to Fellowship with Friends at my sister's place. During this time many stones were thrown in the Fellowship Meetings.
Seeing that we still respected, agreed and supported Uncle Hoa's work, gradually Mr. Lyle changed his face and became cool to me. Then I noticed that he didn't want to shake hands with me. I told my sister about his actions. At first she didn't believe what I told her. After the next meeting at her place, Mr. Lyle went around shaking hands with each member in the meeting. My sister and I were standing in front of him and he shook hands with my sister, ignored me and went ahead to the next Friend and shook their hands. Smiling and glancing at my sister, I asked her, "Now that you witnessed it with your own eyes, do you believe me?"
Immediately my sister pulled his sleeve and asked him, "Why you don't shake hands with my sister?" Of course, he didn't know that was the day I wanted to prove his actions to my sister. He then turned back and shook hands with me, saying, "Sorry, I haven't shaken hands with you!" As for me, Uncle Lyle is really a twisting man.
Tân and Bình, a very faithful couple (ex-Elders) told us the same story; that Mr. Lyle S. shows them his cool face also, seeing that they still cooperated with us and Uncle Hoa, visiting Friends in the countryside. When I told Uncle Châu this story, he said to me, "I don't want to hear. Don't judge others. If you still tell the wrong about others, I will not contact with you anymore." My answer to Uncle Châu was, "I just tell you the truth. You may ask my sister whether it was true or not."
Uncle Lyle began trying to push us out. When my sister was repairing her house, he removed the Fellowship Meeting from her house permanently. That was where we and my parents had gathered for Fellowship with Friends. However, we were not cut off from the Fellowship with God, and He has given us sweet Fellowship now, without any stones.
In his letter, Lyle wrote about Uncle Hoa: “Our friends are at liberty to receive Uncle Hoa into their homes for a visit if they feel comfortable with that. We are not going to try to monitor or control that. We know that many will not feel comfortable about him visiting their home as long as he is not in hearty Fellowship with the teachers in this country.” The implication is that the Workers are not going to tell the Friends to shun Uncle Hoa, but those who are really hearty in the Fellowship won’t feel comfortable having Uncle Hoa around.
Shunning those who leave the Fellowship has been a standard procedure for a long time (Wm. Irvine, Ed Cooney, Joe Kerr, in Alberta Canada, etc.) There’s even a sermon on TTT by Jack Carroll giving instructions to do so. LINK: http://www.tellingthetruth.info/Workers_early/carrolls2.php#shunning
CHAPTER 3 - 2010 – to the present
Continuing in The Way as Before
Golden Friends Follow the Spirit of God
Morris Grovum came to visit my parents before he returned to Canada for his treatment. They were all happily visiting together until at the end of his visit, he asked: “If Mr. Hoa died, who would lead you?” His question made it clear to us that they are all under the leading of man, and we are all under the leading of God. We used to live in Dalat for 25 years, but Workers didn’t have much time to visit/lead us. We gathered with Friends through years under the leading of God, helping and encouraging each other.
Morris G. told Mr. Bau, “I feel pity for you. You cut yourself out of the universal Fellowship.”
Mr. Bau replied: “Now I have had true Fellowship around the world with understanding through the Internet and I am full of joy. You may put your eyes on it and see…I feel pity for you too.”
My father went to England for studying in 1965-1966 and heard much about the work at that time. Traveling in ten countries, he met thousands of Friends and Workers with full of joy and happiness. Until seeing the work of the Canadian workers in Viet Nam under the direction of Mr. Dale, the 2x2 head. Then he was very disappointed. He kept silent, waiting and hoping that one day they would see the wrong in what they had done. However, with the passing of time, we now see clearly that all the mess had been done on purpose. It is not easy for an old man as my father deciding to leave 2x2 system after 50+ years. But he couldn't accept the wrong, the lies and evil work. Most of the relatives of my father and mother are Protestants, including many pastors, and they may tease my parents aboute of their leaving, and stopping after more than 50 faithful years in the2x2 system.However, we don't mind things people speak about us; we're just going on with God.
Recently I received an email from one of the Friends. He wrote “ It seems Uncle Hoa and those who follow him are…” We want to remind everyone that the Golden Friends (more than a hundred) are not following Uncle Hoa. We are all, including Uncle Hoa, under the leading of the Spirit of God, and we follow the footsteps of Jesus Christ in the Bible.
The Old Testament Prophets told about the Everlasting New Covenant that would come; a time when man would no longer need a human to teach them, for the Holy Spirit would come and guide each believer individually. Jeremiah wrote: Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. (Jer. 31:31-34)
Isaiah wrote: And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it, when ye turn to the right hand, and when ye turn to the left. (Is. 30:21)
Originally, there were around 250 Friends in VN. Owing to the causes given above, the Friends and Workers are now divided into 3 groups. (1) Those who completely support the Canadian Overseers. (2) Those who are still in the fellowship but are not satisfied with the situation and choose to “wait and see” what will happen, waiting for a new future. (3) The Golden Friends who continue walk with God as before and do not fear what they will do, and are not under any rule of man. Many of the Friends and Workers who follow the Canadian Overseers have only professed for a short time, so they didn’t experience the Golden Time.
There are more than 100 Golden Friends--we can't count precisely because many friends in the countryside cannot come because of the distance, their health, or their busy work. Day by day, we welcome more Friends into our sweet Fellowship like the Golden Time. Almost all the Golden Friends live in the South of VN, some in the Central, a couple in Ha Noi.
So for the last three years until now, we have held our own Meetings and we get on much better. Our thinking, beliefs, teachings and doctrines have changed from when we were 2x2s. For example, we tried to please the workers, often treating them to good meals, giving them the highest respect, etc. Gradually, we examined ourselves, and were astonished because we discovered that we were worshipping the overseer and workers. And we had many fears, such as not attending all meetings, visiting friends in another field, afraid to ask about things we didn't understand. Now we are joyful to be free from those things.
We are thankful God is still reigning, taking care and keeping all of us who want to serve God with our whole heart. No one can cut off our Fellowship with the Lord. Jesus said: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. (John 10: 27)
Currently in February, 2014 in Saigon/HCMC, there are six Meetings total, and the Meetings are divided into two groups. Five Meetings who accept all Workers--except for Uncle Hoa; and one Meeting held in Mr. Bau’s house which only accepts the Worker Uncle Hoa. There are more than 10 Golden Elders in VN who support Uncle Hoa so he can continue to offer his life in the harvest field. There are other Meetings in VN which only accept Uncle Hoa which are held in Huế, DiLinh, Dalat, Baria Suối Lạnh, Phước Long, Bình Long.
After these experiences our Fellowship with God is more precious. Even if we have few or many Friends, we all have the same spirit, the unity and love to God, and Friends. We never want to be in a Fellowship that is not being led by the Spirit of God. God has shown us His love and His care upon us. We had always thought that we were serving God and not man. At last God has revealed to us that the Workers organisation was not His True Way and we must continue seeking our God and His Kingdom everyday. ‘The Lord said These people come near to me with their mouth and honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. Their worship of me is made up only of rules taught by men.’ (Is. 29:13 NIV)
We just look to Jesus and hold His hand to step forward until the end of our lives. After reading all the messages and posts, my husband said and I agree…‘Now God gives us the real wonderful Fellowship, with love, comfort, and understanding…throughout the whole world.’ We have known about the origin of 2x2s not more than a year. Up to now, most Golden Friends and the rest haven't known the origin of 2x2 or about TTT, and the reason they left is not because they read the TTT website or know any thing about the origin of the 2x2ism. Very few Vietnamese can understand English or work with computer or have access to the internet. The Golden Friends haven't cooperated with the Canadian overseers because they didn't see the fruit of the spirit in them--not because of any website. “By their fruit shall ye know them.” ( Matthew 7:16)
Uncle Hoa wrote about his spirit-led work: Now I am thankful and happy to see Our Heavenly Father's hand working on our side. Our VN friends could tell you what going on in VN concerning the blessings from the hand of our God. Those big smiles you see on their faces in photos taken at various places are completely genuine, no making up at all.
I am thankful so much for the great inspiration which I consider as a very considerable reward and great privilege to be in close fellowship with those you have seen in photos taken here and there. Each of them owns a very clear-cut attitude, and a very brave decision of being with the minority rather than the majority. If the Spirit of God doesn't move them, they surely can't go thus far. Human being is mostly a coward. I highly appreciate the freedom in Sprit that the Lord grants to me in His Name and in His Service. (View Photos in Hoan & Minh Thanh's Photo Bucket)
Some have asked about our future: “What are you going to do after Hoa has passed on?” After Liberation Day all the foreign Workers left VN. As for me, they passed on from that day because no one among them returned to VN to preach. What did we do after they all left? The Golden Time proved to people all over the world that God can and has led us all through these years. We’re still in God’s hand and he plans for us, so we don’t need to worry about what we are going to do. Just like when the Workers left VN in 1975, we trust in His Mighty Hand, and that is how we will go on now…God will take care of us in the future.
When asked: If all the Canadian workers go back to their country, would you return to the fellowship with 2x2s? Xuân Hoàn’s answer was: We all love the Friends and Workers, we love their souls. Now we know the truth, we do not accept the religion of Overseers any more. We desire God rules and leads our lives--not Overseers.
We trust and believe in His love and care just like Psalm 3:1-6 -LORD, how many are my foes! How many rise up against me! Many are saying of me, “God will not deliver him.” But you, LORD, are a shield around me, my glory, the One who lifts my head high. I call out to the LORD, and he answers me from his holy mountain. I lie down and sleep; I wake again, because the LORD sustains me. I will not fear though tens of thousands assail me on every side.”
Some months ago I received an email from a person who had followed this situation very carefully. He was very sad to let me know that: ‘It seems the responsible Workers didn't want to solve the problem!’ This is the reason why we have to speak out...so everyone can understand clearly our choice, our situation, and the reason why things are the way they are in Vietnam. As Hymn 372 says…
In the warfare we are waging for the truth and for the right,
When the conflict fierce is raging with the power of the night.
God need Workers brave and true; May He, then, depend on you?
Approved by: Nguyễn Minh Thanh, Nguyễn Xuân Hoàn and Nguyễn Huu Bau
Email contact: firstname.lastname@example.org
Date: February 24, 2014
Lasts Revised April 2, 2014
We give specific permission to Cherie Kropp, Edgar Massey and Brad Lewis to post this Account of Vietnam on their websites. Others desiring permission, please email Cherie Kropp at email@example.com
Uncle Chau: Uncle Chau's brother living in America obtained the required visa/papers for Chau to come to America to visit his family. The workers arranged for Chau to speak at some West Coast USA conventions, after which he returned to his family. He spent three months mostly in California. He was unable to get his visa extended, so he returned to VN on June 6, 2014. He was sent to Cambodia to be under Lloyd Morgan, who is about 55 years old. For an older man to serve under a much younger man is considered a disgrace in VN culture. Further, Chau does not speak the Cambodian language. Colin Brodie is the overseer of VN at this time. Uncle Châu returned to VN on November 3, 2014 from Cambodia.
The Aftermath...Shades of the Past...similar to the 1999 Alberta, Canada purging.
July 22, 2014, Minh Thanh wrote: We had an interesting weekend. We returned to Đalạt 300 km away, where we used to live before moving to Saigon. We had many sweet memories of fellowship with friends there for 25 years. Now there are only about 5 or 6 of God’s people left there. Two senior sisters, a sickly old grandmother and an aunt of a young sister worker who seldom attends meetings because of the grandmother’s health and the aunt has two little babies.
Since then, a married couple from Hà Nội moved there and became the Elders. We valued and supported each other spiritually and materially…until the overseer and young workers cooperated to cause the mess in Vietnam. The workers sowed in this couple’s heart many things that caused them to have a different perspective toward the native workers, the two sister friends and us. When the two sister friends went to visit the Golden Fiends with us, immediately this new Elder gave them a choice.
One of the two sister friends answered: “A long time ago, we chose in our hearts that we would keep our heart faithful to God in true fellowship with our friends with love and unity. Now you ask me to make a choice and I have already chosen in my heart. If I continue communicating with you all, it is because I want to keep the love and the support of each other spiritually.”
They still have the love among them but because the elder must obey the workers, they were forced to separate. We felt sad because it was only a very small group of 5-6 and now they are divided although their hearts didn’t agree. In that small town there are now two separate fellowship meetings--each place with only 2 people!
Long Thanh: A Golden Friend retold the story to the two senior sisters from Dalat of the visit in Long Thanh. After listening it, one of them sighed: “One more time causing division.” That sister thought of the pain of the elder brother and his younger sister. The elder brother had a stroke and sat in his wheelchair during our recent visit in Long Thanh. His little sister was the wife of the Elder that the party of Colin, Peter and a native worker came to separate them from the meeting.
A similar case happened to Chị Tâm two years ago where a sister friend had a grandson attending an English class at the Elder’s house in Dalat. Her grandson didn’t understand why the grandmother didn’t come to the Elder’s house (his teacher) to have fellowship any more. The same question was in her son’s mind. It’s hard for her to explain, because she still keeps good relationship with the elder’s family (but not in faith).
Binh Tan's Family: Here is a zealous couple who often accompany the workers through many decades, the same as Priscilla and Aquila in Acts 18. They live in Dong Nai Province, Phuong Lam District, 135 kilometers from Saigòn.
This couple was a victim of Mr. Lyle…the same as the couple in Long Thành recently with Colin (the temporary overseer in Viet Nam). Mr. Lyle cut off the meetings in their home which were established by our native workers through many years, and also cut off their position as an Elder…transferred the meeting to the next house of her youngest sister, causing the separation in their family known to be full of love and harmony.
Can you imagine? There are five Friends at Phương Lâm, and now two houses very close together, have two fellowship meetings! Only God knows who belong to Him and serves Him. It causes pain to our native Workers, because they love their sheep, and never wanted them to be divided like this. Mr. Lyle did the same to my parents’ family too. I thought of the verse: “Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called children of God.” And I felt sad for the people who caused the division in our country. (Minh Thanh)
The Golden Friends look for ways to show their love, kindness and care for their brothers and sisters in Christ who live far away and/or are unable to get to meetings in Saigon. Recently on occasion, they have rented passenger vans and 12 to 16 people took day trips to visit and have meetings with these people. Uncle Hoa always goes on his motorcycle, and then he stays with the group. Taking his motorbike makes it convenient for him to go and visit other places after the gathering. Some foreign Friends who appreciate what the Golden Friends are doing have helped with travel expenses. Some have professed during these visits.
Special Meeting: On September 7, 2014, the Golden Friends held a large Special Meeting. More than 90 people gathered in Di Linh from 18 different places. They took three passenger vans with 40 to 60 people from Saigon and others travelled by bus. Some traveled a day before, and some traveled during the night. They came from 50 to 250 kilometers away, and some more than 1,000 kilometers. Unfortunately, some friends could not come because they were not in good health. The meeting lasted for 4 hours, with Uncle Hoa being the only preacher. The love, joy and unity of meeting together in fellowship encouraged us and we felt our cup overflowed. (Minh Thanh)
Giang: A young man named Giang listened to the gospel through Uncle Chau and professed through 2x2 workers in the time when the mess was happening. Now he accompanies Uncle Hoa whenever he has time. He took his mother to the Special Meeting, crossing more than 1,000 kilometers. They live in Chau Doc, the utmost south of Vietnam. Giang had a childhood with sadness and difficulties so he depends on God as his source of comfort for his soul. He talks little, and lives and serves in silence, the same as the spirit of hymn "Today is mine to do a loving deed." We are happy and encouraged every time he has a chance to communicate with the Golden Friends. (Minh Thanh)
The Golden Friends viewpoint: "Submission to the will of the organization is not always the same as submission to the will of God."